Engine Swap

[Squidward]

Greetings. New on the forum and looking forward it.

Last December, two of my close friends and I chipped in to buying a Ranger 29 powered by Penta MB10A. Since then we fixed lot of things and lately the transmission won't engage in reverse. I found a good running A4 locally and wondering if I should swap out the Penta instead of chasing after hard to find parts and pouring money into it. How difficult of a job I am looking at from time, money and effort point of view? Would any member on the forum who has done similar swap share his/her experiences. Thank you.

[The Garbone]

When we purchased our 78' Catlina 30 it had no motor but was a diesel in a past life.

I had to alter the motor bed using a home made gig to align it with the shaft. Also chose to replace the fuel tank for new. Had to also aquire the proper cables (salvaged) as the A4 shifts pretty hard. In addition to a new prop to match the changed pwer profile.

There are other threads in here about similar conversion. Can be done for less than a new Beta but it not that cheap. Of course this forum makes it worth it to me, I could not find anywhere near the of support Moyer and this forum gives for my low cost diesel repower options, and that has definate value.

[BunnyPlanet169]

Greetings Squidward - welcome to the forum!

I haven't swapped, but did, in a moment of weakness and frustration, price out a Beta 15..... .

As Gary suggests, a significant and often underestimated part of a conversion is swapping everything else: exhaust, controls, tank, fuel systems and re-propping. Ballpark, the engine was $8K and everything else was maybe 2 or $3K. The motor is the big chunk, no doubt, but you'll be buying or scrounging the rest. That's still a lot less than new!

[Mo]

allot of work.

I'll be honest. Changing from Volvo Penta to Atomic 4 involves some work:

-engine bed rail differences
-wiring differences
-prop shaft diameter differences
-prop size different (won't work)
-fuel delivery changes
-filtering changes
....most of these changes are fabrication work to fit you boat specific so they do take time and effort. It's not going to be "swap". The atomic 4 is a real good engine, and I do my best to support it, but you might be better off to stick with what you have in there already. I know of one Volvo although I'm not particularly a fan of them...

Volvo engine mentioned to me last week: I don't remember the HP; ...new rebuilt by volvo but I don't know if it is still available. Owner from England and was going to sail boat back across Atlantic and changed plans. Apparently the engine is out of the boat (was never put in it) and a spare parts engine goes with it. This got mentioned to me last week. $2500 (I think)
Doyle Sails in Dartmouth Nova Scotia, 20 Wright Av, Dartmouth, NS B3B 1G6
(902) 465-7245 Canada; call and ask Brad about Volvo engine for sale; Brad will give you the guys contacts.

[hanleyclifford]

I'll be honest. Changing from Volvo Penta to Atomic 4 involves some work:

-engine bed rail differences
-wiring differences
-prop shaft diameter differences
-prop size different (won't work)
-fuel delivery changes
-filtering changes
....most of these changes are fabrication work to fit you boat specific so they do take time and effort. It's not going to be "swap". The atomic 4 is a real good engine, and I do my best to support it, but you might be better off to stick with what you have in there already. I know of one Volvo although I'm not particularly a fan of them...

Volvo engine mentioned to me last week: I don't remember the HP; ...new rebuilt by volvo but I don't know if it is still available. Owner from England and was going to sail boat back across Atlantic and changed plans. Apparently the engine is out of the boat (was never put in it) and a spare parts engine goes with it. This got mentioned to me last week. $2500 (I think)
Doyle Sails in Dartmouth Nova Scotia, 20 Wright Av, Dartmouth, NS B3B 1G6
(902) 465-7245 Canada; call and ask Brad about Volvo engine for sale; Brad will give you the guys contacts.

But Mo, don't you tow diesel powered sailboats back to harbor kinda regular?

[Mark Millbauer]

Like Garbone I converted my C30 over to an A4. In my case the boat came with a siezed Yanmar. If you love A4's as much as we do then know that its doable. On the other hand if you were to stumble into a deal on an appropriate diesel engine the project might be a bit less complicated. The engine placement in the C30 (Center of salon) was a big plus due to excellent access. If you do convert to an A4 be prepared to hear some criticism from sailors that don't understand our beloved motors. And I can assure you that I would have stayed with a diesel had we not had the unmatched support and service of Don Moyer and this group.

Mark

[ndutton]

I'd make this swap in a heartbeat, no question. The Ranger 29 was originally built with an Atomic 4 so this should be easier than most, hopefully reverting back to the original configuration. Since your Volvo is a gas engine* the fuel system should not require any modification. You'll deal with aligning the engine to the current shaft angle, have to change the throttle/shift control and maybe some exhaust work but that's about it. Depending on the Volvo gear ratio (1:1 or 1.9:1) you may have to replace the shaft and prop. Electrics should be virtually identical.

* Small Volvo marine engine designations were either MB-XX or MD-XX. The 'D' indicated diesel, the 'B' for benzene, aka gasoline.

[hanleyclifford]

I'd make this swap in a heartbeat, no question. The Ranger 29 was originally built with an Atomic 4 so this should be easier than most, hopefully reverting back to the original configuration. Since your Volvo is a gas engine* the fuel system should not require any modification. You'll deal with aligning the engine to the current shaft angle, have to change the throttle/shift control and maybe some exhaust work but that's about it. Depending on the Volvo gear ratio (1:1 or 1.9:1) you may have to replace the shaft and prop. Electrics should be virtually identical.

* Small Volvo marine engine designations were either MB-XX or MD-XX. The 'D' indicated diesel, the 'B' for benzene, aka gasoline.

Wow, I didn't know it was a gasoline engine. Still, I agree with Neil; the A4 is a better choice due to the superior parts and information network.

[joe_db]

MB10A:


I am not sure I get the funky 2-lever control. You might consider spending $100 for a Volvo mechanic to take a look before ditching that engine. Might be an easy fix

[BunnyPlanet169]

That is SO old school!

Affordable boating is often antique boating. If my boat was a car, I would definitely qualify for an 'antique' license plate.

I'm sailing the equivelant of a '71 Chevy Vega...

[lat 64]

... You might consider spending $100 for a Volvo mechanic to take a look before ditching that engine. Might be an easy fix

I have to agree with this.
You have a transmission problem. Make sure it is not repairable before going nuclear.

A-4 is still supported. That is why most of us run it. Betas are sweet runners and expensive. Everything about restoring a Volvo is expensive, but don't shoot the ol' girl until she won't pull no more.
Then, if the Volvo gets worn out of reason, make a mooring out of it and go with what you and your buddies pencil out as a favorite.

[Mo]

But Mo, don't you tow diesel powered sailboats back to harbor kinda regular?

Been known to happen Hanley. I saw Neil's post on that engine being a gas...didn't know it was gas either as I've seen lots of MD11's.

[Squidward]

I was thinking in the same line as Neil mentioned when I thought of swapping in an A4.

Lot happened since my post on the forum yesterday. I met the A4 seller after work today. The mechanical pump needs the diaphragm replaced. Other than that the engine and transmission ran good. The seller made me a offer I could not refuse. As of 6pm today I am a proud A4 owner.

To answer Lat64, I figured out what is the problem with the Penta MSB transmission. However, got tired of searching for the spare parts without much luck. The Penta MB10A engine itself runs really good. This morning Ted (one of the friends) found a parts MB10A in Garland, TX. We are in Houston. Ted picked up the engine and transmission for $350 this afternoon and on his way to Houston now. I was thinking in the same line as Neil mentioned when I thought of swapping in an A4.

Lot happened since my post on the forum yesterday. I went to see the A4 after work. Other than the mechanical pump the engine and transmission ran good. The seller made me a offer I could not refuse. As of 6pm today, I am a proud A4 owner.

To answer Lat64, I know the what is the problem with the Penta MSB transmission but got tired of searching for the spare parts without much luck. The Penta MB10A engine itself runs really smooth. This morning Ted (one of the friends) found a parts MB10A. Ted picked up the engine and transmission for $350 from Garland, TX and on his way to Houston now. We are planning to rebuild the Penta transmission with parts from spare MB10A, and keep the A4 for future. If that does not work, A4 is going in the Ranger.

We will convert the A4 to electric fuel pump and ignition and may be fresh water cooling before the swap. Let me know if you think of anything else we should do to the A4. With the information and support on this forum, and the parts available, I got a feeling that it will be a fun project.

Joe, the Penta we got looks nothing like the pic your have posted http://albinmotor.nl/wp-content/uplo...B10_motor2.jpg


Thanks to all for your inputs. Sorry for not mentioning that MB10A is gas a engine.

[lat 64]

Keep us posted on the Volvo anyway. It's all good data for gassers.

The question of when to pull the trigger is a common one on this forum.

Keep smiling,
Russ