Originally posted by joe_db
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Last edited by hanleyclifford; 11-10-2023, 07:55 PM.
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Originally posted by joe_db View PostIf I do it the way you did I'll need to dig up a junk engine to work on.
I was thinking about something like this, but designed for the bolt pattern on the front of the A4.
I can mock it up in wood first and then get it cut in metal.
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Joe, seems like a lot of work both for you and the A-4 once done. Have you considered "solar"? I built my own solar for my Bene which had both a freezer and fridge for about $600 bucks. It was 350 watts and it would keep up even on cloudy days because it was also cooler and less load for cooling. It is silent and quite reliable. The biggest reason was I did not like charging with the diesel for a few hours every day at anchorage, more time to play. I often did not even plug in at the dock after a cruise as I would be heading out again the next weekend.
I bought a good Victron controller and got my panels on Craig's List from a construction over run, many available. The controller was more than the panels.
Since you have a big boat I think there should be room. I mounted mine to make shade as an aft bimini.
Dave Neptune
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There's a definite rule in electrical design and practice for reliability and longevity: max. 80% loading to design capacity.
Small wonder your alternators survived only three seasons.Neil
1977 Catalina 30
San Pedro, California
prior boats 1987 Westsail 32, 1970 Catalina 22
Had my hands in a few others
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Originally posted by joe_db View Post....
2. Charging at anchor means either annoyingly high RPM or not very many amps. I would really like a better ratio. ...
Let me tell you how I handled this problem.
First, my setup. I had upgraded my alternator to a 110A Amp-Tech with an external Balmar charge controller. When the batteries were low, this would initially put out 60A at 2000 RPM for a little while, then get throttled back to 40A by the Balmar as the temp came up. (This seems to be about the practical maximum for an accessory-drive alternator of ANY size due to the low RPM.) Once the (200AH gel) batteries got close to 80% this would drop WAY back, requiting an additional FOUR HOURS of engine charging to reach full charge!
While I was cruising down the ICW, this was no issue. After 8+ hours of engine time every day, I always anchored with the batteries full, and this easily carried the refrigeration through the night.
However, once we reached Florida, and anchored to wait for a weather window to cross to the Bahamas, charging became an issue.
The 200 watts of Solar charging I had just wasn't enough. I had to run the engine for 3-4 hours each evening to make sure the batteries would have enough charge to be above 50% by morning.. This was unacceptable because of both the fuel usage and the amount of heat it put into the cabin.
So I went ashore and bought a little Honda 1000ei "suitcase" generator. This thing is a marvel. It is light (19 lbs), quiet, and sips fuel. The A4 consumes ~ 1gal/hour. The Honda will run for up to 12 hours on a single tank of gas, a tank being only 0.55gal!!
I could perch it on the stern rail and use it to run my shore charger. A couple of hours was enough to get the batteries up to 80%, and this would be enough last through the night without going below 50%. An additional bonus was that it put no heat into the cabin, making things more comfortable for the crew and putting less load on the fridge/freezer, reducing it's power consumption.
BTW, we were at anchor for 10 days before a weather window opened. This system worked perfectly. And it was a blessing in the Exumas, where gasoline is scarcer than water!
This season, I upgraded to 400 watts of solar, and am in the process of upgrading to Lithium (LiFePO4) batteries. Because of Lithium's ability to stay in bulk charge up to about 95%, I'm hoping the solar will be able collect more than enough energy (on average) to meet my daily needs, and the big (560AH) Lithium battery will get me through 2 or 3 days of no sun.
And I'll still have the Honda to fall back on!@(^.^)@ Ed
1977 Pearson P-323 "Dolce Vita"
with rebuilt Atomic-4
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Originally posted by Dave Neptune View PostJoe, seems like a lot of work both for you and the A-4 once done. Have you considered "solar"? I built my own solar for my Bene which had both a freezer and fridge for about $600 bucks. It was 350 watts and it would keep up even on cloudy days because it was also cooler and less load for cooling. It is silent and quite reliable. The biggest reason was I did not like charging with the diesel for a few hours every day at anchorage, more time to play. I often did not even plug in at the dock after a cruise as I would be heading out again the next weekend.
I bought a good Victron controller and got my panels on Craig's List from a construction over run, many available. The controller was more than the panels.
Since you have a big boat I think there should be room. I mounted mine to make shade as an aft bimini.
Dave NeptuneJoe Della Barba
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
Maryland USA
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Originally posted by ndutton View PostThere's a definite rule in electrical design and practice for reliability and longevity: max. 80% loading to design capacity.
Small wonder your alternators survived only three seasons.
My brother was impressed when the alternator died in mid-cruise once. It was off and the spare on in about 20 minutes. He said "Obviously this is not the first time this happened"Joe Della Barba
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
Maryland USA
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Originally posted by hanleyclifford View PostThat bracket only offers 9" from crankshaft to alternator - not enough to get you high and outboard enough to clear the starter. However, if you have a late style flywheel housing with the flat steel cover you have a more robust casting especially if you are willing to cobble some extra bracketry on it to secure the new cover/alternator bracket. You also have a partial pattern to start creating your own home made bracket probably from thick aluminum. There would remain the need for a sheave and crankshaft adapter ( I think Moyer sells one ). Your approach solves the parallel axes of rotation issue more easily than mine.Joe Della Barba
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
Maryland USA
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Originally posted by edwardc View PostJoe,
Let me tell you how I handled this problem.
First, my setup. I had upgraded my alternator to a 110A Amp-Tech with an external Balmar charge controller. When the batteries were low, this would initially put out 60A at 2000 RPM for a little while, then get throttled back to 40A by the Balmar as the temp came up. (This seems to be about the practical maximum for an accessory-drive alternator of ANY size due to the low RPM.) Once the (200AH gel) batteries got close to 80% this would drop WAY back, requiting an additional FOUR HOURS of engine charging to reach full charge!
While I was cruising down the ICW, this was no issue. After 8+ hours of engine time every day, I always anchored with the batteries full, and this easily carried the refrigeration through the night.
However, once we reached Florida, and anchored to wait for a weather window to cross to the Bahamas, charging became an issue.
The 200 watts of Solar charging I had just wasn't enough. I had to run the engine for 3-4 hours each evening to make sure the batteries would have enough charge to be above 50% by morning.. This was unacceptable because of both the fuel usage and the amount of heat it put into the cabin.
So I went ashore and bought a little Honda 1000ei "suitcase" generator. This thing is a marvel. It is light (19 lbs), quiet, and sips fuel. The A4 consumes ~ 1gal/hour. The Honda will run for up to 12 hours on a single tank of gas, a tank being only 0.55gal!!
I could perch it on the stern rail and use it to run my shore charger. A couple of hours was enough to get the batteries up to 80%, and this would be enough last through the night without going below 50%. An additional bonus was that it put no heat into the cabin, making things more comfortable for the crew and putting less load on the fridge/freezer, reducing it's power consumption.
BTW, we were at anchor for 10 days before a weather window opened. This system worked perfectly. And it was a blessing in the Exumas, where gasoline is scarcer than water!
This season, I upgraded to 400 watts of solar, and am in the process of upgrading to Lithium (LiFePO4) batteries. Because of Lithium's ability to stay in bulk charge up to about 95%, I'm hoping the solar will be able collect more than enough energy (on average) to meet my daily needs, and the big (560AH) Lithium battery will get me through 2 or 3 days of no sun.
And I'll still have the Honda to fall back on!
Also illustrates why I need a lithium bank sooner or laterJoe Della Barba
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
Maryland USA
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If using your main engine for charging, the BVI charter fleet also uses engine driven refrigeration compressors. One hour run time a day, whether under way or at anchor, meets daily needs.Neil
1977 Catalina 30
San Pedro, California
prior boats 1987 Westsail 32, 1970 Catalina 22
Had my hands in a few others
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Originally posted by edwardc View PostKeep in mind that the A4 only has, at most, 30HP to work with. Use too big an alternator and you risk turning the A4 into a 30HP genset with insufficient power left for propulsion!
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Originally posted by stranded-sailor View PostAre you looking to boost your amperage? I've seen a DC to dc amp booster that I want to try. Hook alt to it than it to batteries. I've seen 20 40 and 60 amp versions.
1. You can't win
2. You can't break even
3. You have to play
At best they act like a MPPT solar charge controller and get a *little more* out of an alternator by converting a lot of amps but sagging voltage into a little less amps and a little more voltage. The tiny gains would not be even close to being worth what they cost for that purpose.
I very much plan to use one of these to charge a lithium bank when I get one, but for different reasons including limiting the power going to the bank and using the correct charge profile.Joe Della Barba
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I
Maryland USA
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