Idle Issues and a delayed restart...

[Sloopdogg]

I bought one of the exchange engines last year.

I was hoping you guys could help me out with an issue I'm having with my new A4.

I just got out for the first time, this year, on Saturday. I had run the engine at the
dock previously but hadn't taken it away from the dock.

So, it does not want to run at low RPMs. The first time I tried to start it, it would not
fire up. I checked the spark plugs and the first one, toward the front was black and
wet. So I swapped them all out with new ones and she fired right up.

On Saturday, when I put her in gear to pull away from the dock she stalled and would not
restart right away, I waited 3-4 minutes and she started right up. We went out, I set sail and left the motor running for a bit with some extra revs, and she kept running.
The moment I tried to bring it down to an idle, she stalled. I just turned the key off
and kept sailing for a while. About an hour and a half later she started right up. I
did notice that as soon as I put her in gear, she started to stutter, I pumped the throttle and she ran all the way into the mouth of the river that leads to our harbor. I backed down on the gas just a little and she stalled in a very narrow channel with some VERY shallow water on either side. I was drifting and she would not restart. I dropped anchor and waited about 5 minutes, trying to start it every minute or so, and finally after the 5, or so, minutes she started right up.

I was able to get all the way to our dock, This time, instead of throttling back, I let
it run at a little higher RPMs and popped it into neutral, she kept running. Then, I felt I could use a little boost and tried to put it in gear, and she stalled under the load. Fortunately, I had just enough momentum to float me into the slip, bow first!

Can anyone shed any light on why this might be happening. Including Saturday, I don't even have 20 hours on this engine.

Last year, she stalled a few times, if I recall correctly, but not nearly as easily as she is now. I remember, coming down on revs and feeling her stutter a bit but, was usually able to just rev her up and keep her running. This year, it seems either, higher revs or she wants to stall...

I have a plastic tank and I pumped it dry and filled with new gas late last
year and only burned about 7-8 gallons through the new engine. I replaced the fuel line and filter in the seperator.

For the winter layup, I refilled the gas tank with fresh gas treated with
"Seafoam" and "Stabil" and added some for the remaining gas in the
tank. Then I ran the engine briefly, enough to run ten gallons of fresh water then 2 gallons of antifreeze through the block and out the exhaust ( I used the RV stuff).

I did not replace the fuel filter cartridge this year as I felt I hadn't run enough fuel through it to warrant it.

Don Moyer has suggested that it sounds like a lean idle mixture and to try adjusting that. If that does't work to "remove the main passage plug at the bottom of the carburetor, Since this passageway is the lowest point in the carburetor, any droplets of water or other crud will come flushing out..." If that doesn't work to pull the carb and clean it. I just happen to have a freshly rebuilt spare in my shop so I'd probably just swap it out.

He wasn't too sure on why the engine needs to sit for a few minutes before re-starting after a stall. She doesn't even stutter or anything while cranking. Then after a few minutes, a quick turn of the key has her running.

I just figured I'd throw this out to the forum and get as many insights as I can before I head down and start playing with it.

[JOHN COOKSON]

The 5 minute wait could be something electrical. See if you are getting spark when it won't fire. Pull the center lead out of the distributor cap and hold it near the engine and check for spark while cranking.
The poor idle and stall sounds like fuel system to me. Bet the rebuilt carb works.


TRUE GRIT

[Dave Neptune]

Flooding?

Danny, you stated that you found the plugs wet and a changed-out for fresh plugs when she fired right up. Did you look at the plugs on any of the subsequent stalls. Could be rich and flooding out, this 5 minute scenario is also consistant with "flooded restarts", the coil issue is usually far longer of a time like 15~20 minutes.

Check to see if your choke is opening when released and for fuel in the throat of the carb incase it's flooding via the float assembly.

Dave Neptune

[Sloopdogg]

The 5 minute wait could be something electrical. See if you are getting spark when it won't fire. Pull the center lead out of the distributor cap and hold it near the engine and check for spark while cranking.
The poor idle and stall sounds like fuel system to me. Bet the rebuilt carb works.


TRUE GRIT

Yea, the carb on it is actually brand new (well, probably rebuilt) with the new exchange engine.

I'm not sure about the whole not getting spark thing... It runs fine at higher RPMs... But I could try that anyway...

Danny, you stated that you found the plugs wet and a changed-out for fresh plugs when she fired right up. Did you look at the plugs on any of the subsequent stalls. Could be rich and flooding out, this 5 minute scenario is also consistant with "flooded restarts", the coil issue is usually far longer of a time like 15~20 minutes.

Check to see if your choke is opening when released and for fuel in the throat of the carb incase it's flooding via the float assembly.

Dave Neptune

Are you thinking that perhaps the choke doesn't fully open when I push the cable back in and she runs rich? I have to say, I hate my choke cable! I should replace it. Any suggestions on where to get one?

[Dave Neptune]

info

Danny, I suggest MMI as they carry a good quality one. A cheap one from a parts house may be OK but will probably rust out and get sticky.

Whether or not the p[lugs are dry/wet when a no restart happens is also needed info.

You can check spark by holding a spark plug against the block with a plastic handle of some sort and then crank the engine. An old plug will be fast and easy to grab when she does it again so you can check for spark.

This is needed info to diagnose what system or systems are giving you issue.

Dave Neptune

[Sloopdogg]

Danny, I suggest MMI as they carry a good quality one. A cheap one from a parts house may be OK but will probably rust out and get sticky.

Whether or not the p[lugs are dry/wet when a no restart happens is also needed info.

You can check spark by holding a spark plug against the block with a plastic handle of some sort and then crank the engine. An old plug will be fast and easy to grab when she does it again so you can check for spark.

This is needed info to diagnose what system or systems are giving you issue.

Dave Neptune

Yea,,, I was never really in a place, when it stalled, to screw around with it and I knew (hoped) it would start in a few minutes. I didn't want to concern our guests and just wanted to get them home. By the time reached the dock I was shot and just wanted to button her up and go home.

I really didn't have this issue last year. I did not drain the carb for layup... maybe that crappy new gas gummed things up...you should have seen what it did to generator when I did not treat the gas and it sat for a year.... it was like jelly in the carb.

[yeahjohn]

Yeah, I would say carb needs cleaned for sure. The second you start the engine crud gets blown into all the little ports and jets then you are toast. Clean carb, put on a new water separator and fuel filter, shoot some gas out of fuel system before reconnecting fuel line to carb, then hook up cleaned carb. The worst scenario is cleaning the carb and then shooting crud right back into it. Once you know for a fact that your carb is perfect then I would start trouble shooting from there.

[High Hopes]

Wet plugs is a fuel issue. You said you hated the choke cable. That might be a clue about what is wrong.

[Sloopdogg]

Yea, I mean, I moves in and out... I just wish I new when it was fully in and fully out...
like if it had a stop our something...

[romantic comedy]

Just rebuild the carb, to be sure. No biggie

[TomG]

I did not drain the carb for layup... maybe that crappy new gas gummed things up...

If you didn't drain the carb before layup, I would start there. Even with StaBil or Seafoam, I would suspect enough moisture found its way into the carb to make a mess, especially if you are forced to use ethanol-laced gasoline. Rebuilding the carb really isn't that hard. You might be able to get a sense of what you're up against if you were to drain the carb now.

[hanleyclifford]

You should know that Stabil and other such products do not protect against the evils of ethanol, advertising claims notwithstanding. Best to drain all fuel at the end of season and start with fresh each spring.

[Sloopdogg]

I guess there is no real good way to deal with it...if I drain the tank the, condensation is the problem...

I think I should have drained the carb...

I will try and drain the bowl. If it looks bad, I'll throw the angry rebuilt can on and see before it runs.

I'll also change the separator filter and in line filter.

That should do the trick... I really don't thunk it odd necessary to drain the treated fuel but, that may beer because I don't want to desk with it... But everything I've read about reading your fuel send to be positive

[roadnsky]

...I really don't thunk it odd necessary to drain the treated fuel but, that may beer because I don't want to desk with it... But everything I've read about reading your fuel send to be positive

Huh?!

[High Hopes]

Yea, I mean, I moves in and out... I just wish I new when it was fully in and fully out...
like if it had a stop our something...

I had the same problem so I installed a lighter cable wire. But then the cable could vibrate out of position. The carburetor spring had to be changed with a weaker one. Still not great. I can't win
Someone said that Don sells a good cable. That's the next improvement attempt.