Bowen Island Paint Job

[Marty Levenson]

taps

Thank you, sir!

[Marty Levenson]

drilling and tapping with head off or on?

My MM repair stud tapping kit arrived today. Reading through the instructions and looking at everything makes me wonder if I might be wise to leave the head on.

6 leaking bolts can be removed, threads in and out cleaned, and reseated with the head on. 10 non leaking bolts won't have to be re-torqued, won't risk stripping those. Head gasket won't need to be replaced. Big question is how hard it will be to drill and tap the one slipping stud. Seems that leaving the head on actually keeps everything aligned, as mentioned in the instructions.

Only plus for removing the head is to be able to eyeball the valves and cylinders. They all looked fine to me a couple months ago....

Can anyone who has done this job please give me any hints/suggestions?

Thanks!

[ILikeRust]

If it were me, I would be leaning towards taking the head off so I could take a really good look at everything and have another go at getting everything good and sealed. Maybe even buy another set of Moyer head gaskets to make sure I'm starting from square zero with all good stuff again.

Did you have the head or block mating surfaces machined or ground or anything? I'm wondering about flatness. When I did my engine, I had the head and block surface ground. I told the shop I wanted them to take off the minimum amount possible - just enough to get it flat for gasketing. I didn't want them to mill it down with a milling machine and thin the castings too much. They did a great job. Then I had them re-cut the valve seats, which I then lapped by hand.

I never did actually measure the compression, but it runs great and I never had even the tiniest leak.

When you pulled and replaced the head the first time, you did use both head gaskets, yes?

Just tossing stuff out here...

[Marty Levenson]

drilling and tapping with head off or on? #2

Thanks for your thoughts on that, Rust.

Yes: used two new head gaskets and new head. Block's mating surface was correctly milled by PO, I believe. It looked good, was flat any way I could measure it, and there are no leaks at the head gasket. One stud hole (left picture) had a slight pucker around it. A small chip came off, but seemed quite smooth after I filed that down. Actually looks worse in the photo than it was. I think that is the stud that stripped on the final torque at temperature.

A4 does run really well: sounds good and quiet. I wouldn't know about the somewhat low compression if I hadn't measured. (Wondering why #2 and #3 are much lower that #1 and #4?) (Follow-up: the oil I took from the filter sat a few days without any sign of settling.)

Only other problems are leaks in a few studs (likely my bad using Perm #1 instead of #2 on threads) and the one stripped stud (which I'm hoping someone will confirm isn't too hard to re-drill and tap with the head on).

I did find a couple photos of the valves, taken a couple months ago. Does anything there indicate a problem?

Recapping a previous post, I'm still thinking that running with lots of MMO in gas, and a few drops of MMO on the cylinders every few days, will loosen up the rings. Apparently MMO vaporizes out if the gas and lubricates everything. Also very frequent oil and oil filter changes. Gotta say I'm sure glad I opted for the oil filter.

Thanks!

[Marty Levenson]

sea foam?

I'm wondering about one of the engine treatment products before I change the oil and filter. Anyone try that? In gas or in oil? Already using MMO in cylinders and in gas.

Thanks!

[ILikeRust]

You mean like STP or something? My main concern would be a potential effect on the clutch in the reversing gear.

I used to have a 1990 Mazda Miata - great little car. One standard syndrome commonly encountered on those cars is what's known as HLA tap. The valve train uses hydraulic lash adjusters (HLAs - very much like hydraulic lifters, but slightly different. Anyhow, as the engines age, the tiny little passages in the HLAs that allows the oil to flow through can gum up, making the HLAs a little "lazy". The engine can then sound like it has a little valve tap, although there's nothing wrong with it at all and it runs perfectly.

I discovered through lots of Googling a neat solution for the issue. Automatic transmission fluid (ATF) has very different properties than engine oil. This guy posts a procedure for using ATF to clean out the HLAs. The procedure was to use a combination of ATF and 50-weight oil to fill the crankcase. The heavy oil was cut by the thinner, highly detergent ATF. You put a new, cheap WalMart oil filter in and let the engine just sit and run for an hour or more. Then drain it all out really well, then put in new good-quality engine oil and a new filter.

It worked perfectly. My engine, which previously had a pronounced "tap tap tap tap tap" that made it sound like a worn-out farm tractor, became silent and smooth, like a watch. That HLA tap never came back.

I've been wondering if something like that might work for the A4 - but as I said, my main concern would be how that might affect the clutch, since the reversing gear is bathed in the same oil that is in the crankcase. I would wonder if the ATF or STP or whatever cleaner or modifier you put in there would soak into the clutch pack and either make it slip or shorten the life of the clutch plates. And also the reversing brake band.

Paging Don Moyer... paging Don Moyer...

[Don Moyer]

Great post Bill, I'll get back to you as soon as I can. It will take more time than I have at the moment for a thoughtful response (I'm getting ready to launch our little 17 foot Shamrock runabout). Don

[Marty Levenson]

water pump

Thanks for the reply, Rust....I'll wait on more info from Don, and on the results of continual MMO treatment.

My water pump works great, but has a slow drip from the oblong opening on the bottom, in front of the main body. Would that mean I need a new seal?

Thanks!

[Don Moyer]

Thanks for your patience Bill, things have heated up around here lately due to a lot of Atomic 4 powered boats apparently being thrown back into the water.

In any case, the only thing I can add to your post, and the thing that peaked my curiosity, is that a lot of our customers in Canada (where MMO isn't readily available) are using ATF fluid much like we use MMO here south of the border, and reportedly with good success.

With reference to your specific concern over increasing the lubricity of the oil and threatening the function of the forward clutch assembly, you won't know for sure until you try the procedure using your particular ratio of ATF and regular oil, but the worst case anyone would face would be having to pump the oil out and return to regular oil. Even though we don't have the HLA problem that you did in your Miata, the procedure might address sticky oil rings and be a benefit in reducing oil consumption.

Don

[ArtJ]

Is there a particular type of ATF that is recommended or not recommended?


Regards

[Marty Levenson]

retapped stud failed

On the weekend I carefully drilled and tapped a new hole for my one problem stud. Did it with the head on, using the Moyer kit, re-drilled the 3/8 hole with a 3/8 bit and tapped with brand new 7/16 coarse tap (and then bottoming tap) and the proper oil. Drilled out the head to 7/16. The replacement stud went in and out perfectly several times on the dry fit. Put on some JB weld and started threading in the stud. Started okay, then got tight too soon, but then got easy again....and then never seemed to seat properly. Prayed the JB weld might hold it, left it 48 hours, but on torquing today can't get past 25 - 28 lbs.

1. Am I right in guessing that good ain't enough? (stud is 2nd hole back from the corner, on the manifold side).

2. Why might it have stripped? Can the density of JB cause a problem?

3. Am I right that my next step is head off and install a repair bushing? What size do I want? Do sizes refer to the hole you drill or the diameter of the stud that goes in? Any other option?

Frustrating!!! Boat is almost ready for the engine.

Thanks for any advice!

[hanleyclifford]

It is possible that when drilling the head you went too far and damaged the new threads. Seems best now to pull the head and have a look-see.

[Marty Levenson]

forensic evidence

Thanks, Hanley....I suspect you are right...didn't think of that. The stud unscrewed pretty easy. See photo for how threads look compared to a new same size stud.

Would it be worth a try re-tapping now?

Thanks.

[hanleyclifford]

If you used that stop collar as indicated then you should not have damaged the threads that way. But if the 7/16" threads will not hold I don't think you have any option but to pull the head.

[Marty Levenson]

threads + water pump

Maybe that stud got stripped on the way in, so the threads in the hole didn't have anything to grab? I was thinking that re-tapping might be more like a chaser....cleaning JB Weld out of the threads? Is there any harm in trying?

Not afraid of the work of removing the head, but worried that other studs might not like being loosened and tightened an extra time...asking for more trouble.

Any thoughts on my water pump (seven posts back)?

Thank you yet again.