Getting complicated

[Skywalker]

I thought I had a carb problem. Well, clearly I did because the old one cracked. Got a "new one" from my buddy and it did not appear to be drawing fuel. Checked for clogs but everything checked out. Thought I had a vacuum problem. New gasket no difference.

Symptoms are firing at the very initial moment of cranking, then nothing. Get minimal fire with starter fluid. On a couple of occasions, she "ran" for 3-5 seconds, very poorly.

I put my buddy's working carb (off his A4) and same thing. But hen I noticed something. Th carb was full of fuel, I mean to the point that when I went to spray starter fluid in, fuel ran out after a short spray! This triggered my memory. Same thing with carb 1.

The float needle on both carbs tested well.

So now I have to look elsewhere. I pulled the plugs for info. Numbers 1 and 2 (from the flywheel) were actually a little tan. They are brand new. 3 and 4 were wet, no sign if ever firing.

Went to crank the engine to check for some compression, he thumb test, and my starter screeches and grinds! Oh shhht.

I pulled off the cover plate and the nut, washer and spring fall off in my hand. No retaining pin. The nut is totally b
uggered. I think the starter is ok. I'll get a new nut tomorrow and reinstall.

But back to starting. Now I'm thinking stuck valves after sitting for 18 months. Rings not seated?

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

[Mo]

Get a gauge and check compression. The thumb test is not good enough and I missed stuck valves last year thinking the thumb test was good enough. That particular engine started but stalled in forward.

Another thought. Look at the plugs. Did you have the raw water intake closed...if not close it. Wet gas smelling plugs mean gas...droplets on them mean water. Water can be from head gasket leak or cracked manifold. Cracked manifolds are typically a result of freezing when winterized with antifreeze not strong enough.

So have a good look at the plugs...take a pic of them after turning it over if you can. Get the compression numbers.

You are on the right track me thinks.

[romantic comedy]

also want to check if the plug wires are in the right order.

[Skywalker]

Will bring compression gauge tomorrow.

It's fresh water cooled, so the jacket had regular antifreeze in it, not from winterizing. Gives me some peace of mind that the head is intact.

Will take pictures tomorrow.

Hopefully, the starter isn't buggered and a new retaining nut is all.

BTW, this starter issue is another in a series of crap due to the boat yard the PO used. They botched everything. No retaining pin. I have a long list of sloppy, stupid, or just ignorant screwups from these guys.

Thanks always for the help.

Chris

[Mo]

Chris;
If the starter falls apart you can just bring it into a local starter / alternator repair shop...would only take them a few minutes to sort it out...an hour at the most. It's turning over so your rings will likely be fine.

When I bought my boat I drove to the boat yard in Cotuit Mass and was going to sail her home. There were people crawling all over that place not only on their own boats. The boat yard owner met with me and he was kicking people out that shouldn't be there. Never know who has swapped what some places.

RC
Good Point.

[Skywalker]

I've got the starter in the car. Hopefully, I can get out of the office today to have it looked at. I think the retaining nut just spun off. I hope.

Once I get the starter back on, I'll check compression. In the mean time, I'll double check the wires/plugs.

Should I just squirt some MMO right now, or wait for more diagnostics?

On the bright side, my carb is probably fine!

Chris

[Sony2000]

It would be worthwhile to rmove the valve cover and check the up and down motion of each and every valve and lifter. Paint everything with MMO and add it to the cylinders while turning over the engine.
18 months is a long time.

[sastanley]

Chris, Put away the engine crack (starting fluid) - It does nothing to help the situation. The engine should fire if there is fuel in the carb.

Do you have a hand crank? You could use that to do a compression test.

A compression tester is about $20 at the local Auto Boutique. Get the kind with a 14mm screw in connection (i.e., the cheap Actron works fine.)

If it were me, and I didn't know the status of that starter, I'd take it to a shop and get it fixed now...then when you re-install, you will be sure it is functioning and probably won't need service for another 10-15 years. You put another nut on it, and it spins off again and you have to get it off again, and still bother with getting it fixed. Might as well do it while it is off. I don't know starters..them and alternators are things I take the local pros.

My 2¢

[Skywalker]

Here's the scoop.

Put compression gauge on my 1966 A4.

number 1 110
number 2 110
number 3 95
numner 4 0

ok, off comes the valve cover, and ...



With a little MMO, gentle tap, click, it came down. I was impressed by how clean it was, no sludge, crime, gook.





Double check compression. Number 4 now at 110. Number three was sticking a bit I think. The more I checked, the more it climbed. Started at 80, up to 95. MMO now doing its thing. I bet it matches the others at 110.

I can't work on it tomorrow because I have to get my daughter from Temple University. Thursday it is. Maybe some light at the end of the tunnel

Thanks again for all the help.

Chris

[sastanley]

Chris...if you haven't done so already, take out plugs, squirt MMO into the cylinders and turn the engine over a few times..this will work the MMO into rings and valve guides, allowing it to work from the top down.

i had to do an "MMO treatment" for several months, with the motor in the boat to get #4 to stop sticking..frequent running seems to be the best permanent remedy!

[Mo]

frequent running seems to be the best permanent remedy!

Absolutely, makes all the difference. Even when the boat is stowed for winter it's a good idea to turn that engine over. Mine runs pretty much every day...during the winter I will turn it over every 2 weeks.

Chris,
Once you have that freed up I'd say she fires up no problem. Good hustle.

[Skywalker]

Frequent running, now that sounds like an intervention I could get used to!

I squirted MMO in the top. I figured it would have a day or two to marinate.

Maybe my (formally) sweet running old girl still has some life in her.

Thanks for the help.

Off to get my little girl!

Chris

[Bold Rascal]

Patience and perserverance

Good job Chris!

[sastanley]

Chris, glad I caught you so the MMO can sit for a day or two..exactly what I was hoping..

Nice work.

[Skywalker]

Just got back from Philly with my daughter.

Can't wait to get down to the boat tomorrow.

I was feeling lucky, so I made an appointment for launching next Thursday! If she runs, I'll paint the bottom this weekend and finish putting her back together.

Surveyor (for insurance) coming on Monday or Tuesday.

Mast step Friday? Haven't heard yet.

You guys are one hell of a support system. Great stuff around here. What a positive, can do bunch.

Thanks.