Ericson 27 - Atomic start problemnewbie but not mech newbie

[CajunSpike]

Did quick run to the boat. Pulled manifold outlet fitting. Stuck a screwdriver in outlet hole and stirred it. Started motor, black goo came out manifold exit then ran clear after that. Reassembled and ran 10 mins. No overheat. Motor starts pretty easy with 1/2 choke and little gas. Lots of water out exhaust outlet.

Engine running video

http://cajun.dyndns.org:81/seeker/running.avi

The red hose to the tee split open and leaked. Taped it just to test, will be replaced as noted before.

Now engine cools so cool, it never registers a temperature on the temp gauge.
Not sure thats a good thing either.

In any case THE PUPPY ACTUALLY RUNS!

A motor as old as this is has no business still running but yet it does run..and run well!

OMG thats such a difference from just a few weeks ago when I was checking craigslist for another motor.

YOU GUYS ROCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Definitely feeling the Afourian love..

Bottom line, I replaced the carb, fixed the choke cable, replaced a missing spark arrestor, and adjusted the points to go from an unknown block of metal to a running motor.
All with ya'll standing behind me in the boat when working on it.

[alcodiesel]

I'm feelin' the love here in Norfolk!

[CajunSpike]

Follow up.
Replaced hoses and cross connected as per recommendation.
Adjusted timing by using the 'go fwd till slows, go bwd till slows, find middle spot and stop' method, using distributor.

Buttoned up engine box with covers. Boy does this reduce the engine noise.

Next trip, leaned in, went full choke, crank, no start.
Went about 1/2 choke, crank. Engine started easily and ran smoothly.

I found how to adjust the carb so it doesn't die by pulling throttle full back.
Put trans in fwd, felt powerful and no engine stall.
Put trans in rev, slightly noisier trans sound but worked fine.

Also did the 1.5 turns on the idle screw.

Time to move on to other things to fix.

[CajunSpike]

So Sunday, the weather was so nice I couldn't stand it anymore.
Started the A4(yippee!!) and tossed the lines.

Left the slip and motored into the open water of the marina, heading for the lake. Within a couple of minutes the tranny went from fwd to neutral on its own. Pulled the lever back to neutral, engaged fwd again and continued. After it doing this 3 or 4 times, I didn't feel safe continuing out onto the water. Spun the boat around and headed back to the slip. Got the boat lined up to the slip and tried to go from fwd to reverse but the shift lever was 'stuck' in fwd. Was only after much heavy pushing and actually bumping into a piling, was I able to engage reverse for a second to stop the boat. Also reverse doesn't seem to 'lock in' and stay. I have to hold the shift lever to keep it in reverse.

After getting it tied up, I opened the cockpit compartment and inspected the shift mechanism. There are 4 nuts/screws holding the shift lever to the fiberglass side wall. 3 of the 4 were loose. when you go to shift, the mechanism was moving instead of the shift cable sliding. Got those tightened up but probably need to put lock washers on it, as there are none. After this I was able to get the fwd gear to 'lock in' to something that feels like a fully engaged detent. Did not try going out again.

Also the throttle cable had a bent end on it. Wasn't a bad problem but straightened it out and readjusted the idle not to be too high or too low.

Lubricated the swivel point of the shift lever and throttle while I was there.
Should the A4 tranny be easy/medium/hard to shift gears?
Should it stay locked in reverse once you put the lever there?
Have not yet oiled the tranny shift lever but its on my list.

Wondering if the shift cable is so old it needs changed.
I may disconnect it from the tranny and try to to go fwd/rev to see how hard it is to move with nothing attached.

[edwardc]

The A4 has a detent for fwd, but none for reverse. It should be a little hard to get into fwd. It is normal to have to hold it in reverse.

[lat 64]

Congrats

Just checking in. I had to read the whole thread to catch up.
Great thread. A new member is saved.
I have to say I did not coin the term "engine crack". I think it was Shawn said that(?) But, I did adopt it as a derogatory term for ether—perfect.

Congrats on the progress. It's time to get the reverse gear adjustment video. Forgo beer for a day and order it. As you have found, ALL the answers can be had from this crew.

Hope you have a great season with your "new" boat.

Russ

[JOHN COOKSON]

Wondering if the shift cable is so old it needs changed.
I may disconnect it from the tranny and try to to go fwd/rev to see how hard it is to move with nothing attached.

Sounds like you are on it R\E the shift cable.
When you disconnect the cable from the tranny shift lever make sure the cable is adjusted to match the correct and full travel of the engine tranny lever.

A couple more thoughts.
The shift cable may be corroded inside the outer cover due to moisture build up.
Some boats have shift\throttle cables that are way, way to long. Rather than direct run the cable goes in some sort of unnecessary arc or curve from shifter to engine. This, of course, does not make shifting easy.


TRUE GRIT

[CajunSpike]

There is a definite 180 turn in my shifter cable.
Leaves lever, goes to rear of hull..does 180 and
returns to tranny shift lever under the cockpit.
If I have to guess, its no longer than 15/20 feet.

Are these pretty much standard type cables or specific to the boat/maker?
Any clue?

Thanks John.

Also forgoing a beer is easy since I never acquired the taste for it.
:-)

During this attempted outing, the engine itself never gave so much as a peep of trouble.
Boat feels strong going fwd under power. Once its warmed up, starts up with a quick flick of the key.

The previous owner said to use only ethanol free gas.
Is there a general consensus about whether this is valid or not?

[Dave Neptune]

Most all cables are std. Post a pic and someone will identify the particular brand.

Dave Neptune

[Ram41662]

The previous owner said to use only ethanol free gas.
Is there a general consensus about whether this is valid or not?

Even though this is my first Atomic 4, I would say that is a definite valid point. I do rebuild older British sports cars, mainly Triumphs, and have been know to rebuild old motorcycles, all from the era of the Atomic 4. They share a lot in common. Here's what I've learned about ethanol.

Ethanol is hygroscopic, which means it absorbs water, even atmospheric moisture. Extra water in your fuel is never a good thing. It can cause rust and sludge through out the fuel system.

Ethanol produces +/- 34% less energy than pure petrol. This hurts in a couple of ways. Obviously you're going to use more fuel and get less horsepower. Less obvious is since we are using carburetor engines, even if the octane is listed as the same as pure petrol, the volumetric flow is off, so the jets more often should be changed.

And finally, one I've seen all to often: Ethanol erodes fiberglass tanks, rubber hoses and plastic fuel lines. It will also go after every organic or natural rubber seal it's exposed to. I've bought Triumphs that were brought down by this. All I had to do was replace the seals and lines, flush the whole system, and the car was ready to run.

For my money, I'd stick with ethanol free fuel.

For what it's worth, I also add "lead replacement" to the fuel I use in my British cars. It really does reduce the knock. I'll have to wait and see if I need to do the same with the Atomic 4.

Rick

[JOHN COOKSON]

For my money, I'd stick with ethanol free fuel.
For what it's worth, I also add "lead replacement" to the fuel I use in my British cars. It really does reduce the knock. I'll have to wait and see if I need to do the same with the Atomic 4.
Rick

One does not have a "knock" problem with a 6.3 to 1 compression ratio engine.
The A4 is definitely not a sports car\motorcycle engine.
If they do knock it is time to adjust the timing.

TRUE GRIT

[Ram41662]

One does not have a "knock" problem with a 6.3 to 1 compression ratio engine.
The A4 is definitely not a sports car\motorcycle engine.
If they do knock it is time to adjust the timing.

TRUE GRIT

Yup, you're right. I wasnt thinking about how low the compression and revs are on the Atomic 4.

Does everyone add MMO to their fuel?

[ndutton]

Ethanol produces +/- 34% less energy than pure petrol. This hurts in a couple of ways. Obviously you're going to use more fuel and get less horsepower

That statistic would apply if we were running pure ethanol. More accurately for our usage, this is from an article on cars.com discussing mileage differences with ethanol blends:

The math carries to E10, which has up to 10 percent ethanol. A gallon of E10 has 96.7 percent of the energy in one gallon of gasoline, according to the DOE's Alternative Fuels Data Center.

That means E10 fractionally lowers real-world gas mileage. How much? Try about 3 percent, said Toyota Senior Energy Researcher Mike McCarthy and Ford powertrain spokesman Paul Seredynski. AAA's [spokesman Michael] Green and the EPA both pegged the E10 loss between 3 and 4 percent.

Since I've owned her my A4 has run on a steady diet of E10 with a single additive of 1% MMO with zero adverse effects. The only modification I've made is replacement of the fuel lines with USCG A1-15 barrier lined hose. To keep my fuel clean I replace the fuel filter cartrige and fill plate O-ring regularly and despite marina rules prohibiting the practice, refuel with jerry cans filled at a local high volume gas station. No fuel dock swill in my tanks.

[marthur]

I also regularly ran E10 in my A-4 with no problems. Like Niel, it took only one dose of watery marina fuel to convince me of the value of fresh clean gas from a high volume gas station.

The A-4 is definitely old technology and as such it is not particular about fuel--as long as it is clean. I have mixed old gas, two stroke outboard mix and E-10 into the A-4 fuel tank at various times and there were no problems. The two stroke outboard mix is a great way to lube up the valves, by the way. It works as well as MMO and you might have it handy for the dinghy,.

I have even seen an A-4 start right up and run smoothly on gas that was so old it didn't even smell like gas. It was clean (no water and no crud) but no telling how many years it sat in the tank.

So don't sweat it!

[Ram41662]

Well if I'm understanding you guys, then the A4 gaskets and seals material were either upgraded at sometime or avoided the use of organic rubber, unlike Leyland.

Any damn seal in a Spitfire engine exposed to even 10% ethanol have always dried out or desolved away on me. In cases where I know ethanol is unavoidable (I do live and work in Illinois/Iowa) I make my own gaskets out of an ethanol resistant material.

Also, the Zenith Stromberg 125/150 carb is not forgiving of water in the fuel. From what you say, the Zenith 68 seems to be.

Either way, I'm still a big advocate for staying away from alcohol additive fuel for older carb engines. I've just had too many bad experiences with it. Who knows, maybe the Atomic 4 will change my mind.