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Old 04-23-2020, 08:19 PM
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Newb to the max, a bit overwhelmed

Hey guys, with all the COVID - 19 stuff going around. I bought a second boat after my club shut down. I bought a 1972 Columbia 30 with a blown A4, I also purchased another A4 which is now in my garage.

I'm 35, trying to get my boat outfitted. Just got done figuring out the electrical, I built my own bench test and bought an instrument panel from a consignment shop.

The engine I bought also came with a Walter v drive, but it's not installed.

I just pulled off the carb, and it's just about as basic as any other outboard carb if not easier. What I found interesting is that even in the spare carb there's no clip for the float valve needle, yet the needles both have a divot for the clip. Is it needed? And does it come in the rebuild kit from Don?

I just pulled off the water pump. It's pretty bad, anything else I should really go over before firing her up in my garage? I just replaced the oil with SAE 30 .

Any help would be greatly appreciated. I am trying to get this boat outfitted to be a weekend island cruiser. My home harbor is Channel Islands Ca Oxnard CA.

I still have to pick the old engine out, and then drop this one in. Im steadily getting through the engine. Oh yea all the hoses were hardened.

Also the holes around the transmission housing are missing bolts, I'm not sure if that's where a bracket went or if bolts actually go there.


That's my introduction - my back is taking a toll, so is my brain taking in all these fumes in my extremely small garage. Im super dedicated, and have a little extra money to blow. If you can help me charge through this thing that would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 04-23-2020, 09:04 PM
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No bracket for the float valve needle. The only thing that holds that needle in place is the float itself. Once the needle and the floats are assembled in their respective positions, flip the housing upside down and play with the float. You should see the needle going up and down. You want to ensure that the needle doesn't stick (ie that it moves easily up and down).

Edit: As for the transmission housing, there is a bracket there. That bracket attaches to the transmission housing by two bolts the port side. The bracket supports the transmission cable.
Welcome

Last edited by Ando; 04-24-2020 at 01:00 AM.
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Old 04-23-2020, 10:35 PM
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Welcome...one step at a time.
First, get some ventilation for the workshop. Control the things you can..there will be situations where you can't control the fumes somewhere down the line, but control them where you can. When I was mixing paint for my hull re-do last year, I had a box fan at each end of my small shop (one car garage size but doors at both ends) plus a respirator for the mixing part. I love to have a good time, but being stoned at 0900 in the AM ruined the rest of the day when I had a list of to-do's!
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Old 04-24-2020, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ando View Post
No bracket for the float valve needle. The only thing that holds that needle in place is the float itself. Once the needle and the floats are assembled in their respective positions, flip the housing upside down and play with the float. You should see the needle going up and down. You want to ensure that the needle doesn't stick (ie that it moves easily up and down).

Edit: As for the transmission housing, there is a bracket there. That bracket attaches to the transmission housing by two bolts the port side. The bracket supports the transmission cable.
Welcome
Ok so what allows the float needle to move up with the float, there's nothing attached to the float needle. I just can't visualize how the float actually moves the needle. The only thing is a tab. does the tab bend into the divot at the top of the float needle? I just dont understand how it would actually do its job without a clip attaching the needle to the float tab.
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Old 04-24-2020, 02:50 PM
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If you don't have one the MMI Service and Overhaul Manual is the best $50 you can spend.
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Old 04-24-2020, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rando1201 View Post
Ok so what allows the float needle to move up with the float, there's nothing attached to the float needle. I just can't visualize how the float actually moves the needle. The only thing is a tab. does the tab bend into the divot at the top of the float needle? I just dont understand how it would actually do its job without a clip attaching the needle to the float tab.
It's possible you're visualizing it upside down. The needle sits on top of the float. When the float lowers, the needle drops down and allows fuel to flow. When the float rises, the needle is lifted up and blocks the fuel flow.
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Old 04-24-2020, 07:33 PM
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Carb Needle

Fuel pressure and gravity move the needle down and the float lifts it up to shut off fuel and modulate the level of fuel in the bowl of the carburetor. Some carbs do have a little wire clip that I believe is there to pull the needle down should it get stuck.
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Old 04-24-2020, 10:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indigo View Post
Fuel pressure and gravity move the needle down and the float lifts it up to shut off fuel and modulate the level of fuel in the bowl of the carburetor. Some carbs do have a little wire clip that I believe is there to pull the needle down should it get stuck.
Thanks I get it now.
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Old 04-24-2020, 10:48 PM
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Any idea how to get this nut off?Name:  received_2743202892631720.jpg
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Old 04-25-2020, 01:13 AM
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What the others said about the float needle. As for that nut: there are areas on the engine that, from rust and condensation etc, get fused. Be patient with it. Use the right size wrench first and foremost. Hit it with wd40, wait 30 min and try again. Then use wd40 again and try. If that doesn’t do it, hit the wrench with a hammer...lightly just to loosen the nut a bit. Slowly, slowly. If all else fails, hit it with a torch for a bit and then try again.
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Old 04-25-2020, 01:31 AM
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Regarding the nut, it's penetrating oil, time, and a good impact driver.

My story (pun intended ) is that I have a bunch of air tools that could take apart just about anything. However, in my garage it took 5-10 mins or so to power up the compressor (loud), get the hoses out, lube the tools and get ready with an impact socket.

Then I saw this offer from HD on an cordless impact wrench that used all my same Ridgid batteries. After looking at all the reviews, I bought one.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/RIDGID-1...11SB/303037082

Holy Mother of your preferred deity, IT'S AMAZING!! I say that lightly. I was trying to remove the exact same bolt from an unbolted bearing and housing assembly from my "Puzzle rebuild". I wrapped a rag round it to limit it's movement, grabbed it and put the bigass socket on it...and pressed the trigger. I took almost 10 seconds before it started to move and 5 secs longer... it was off.

It's not often I say that a new tool changed how I use tools... this one has. If you can afford $150, just buy one.

Just my opinionated two cents.
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Last edited by ronstory; 04-25-2020 at 01:33 AM. Reason: typos
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Old 04-25-2020, 07:55 AM
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Have you seen the MMI YouTube video on the subject?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fslgwjnuQc
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prior boats 1987 Westsail 32, 1970 Catalina 22
Had my hands in a few others
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Old 04-25-2020, 10:17 AM
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I ended up cutting it with a dremmel.... it is not an expensive nut, and unless you have the MM tool, or a very good makeshift tool, your impact gun is also impacting the transmission...

With a dremmel: 5 minutes, 2 cuts to release tension and it was out (true it had been sprayed / lubricated for several days before...). Your time fighting is not worth the price of that nut
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Old 04-25-2020, 11:41 AM
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I ended up cutting it with a dremmel.... it is not an expensive nut, and unless you have the MM tool, or a very good makeshift tool, your impact gun is also impacting the transmission...
Yes, but it's like a hammering a rivet, a small object's mass vs a large object's mass to get the desired effect. If you look at mass of the tranny versus the nut its got to be at least 300:1. So 1/300 of the 325ft-lbs is about a foot-pound. Not to mention the tranny was loose in the housing and I held the shaft with my hand, it was just little bit of vibration.

Now imagine similar frozen nut on loose big bolt, the mass ratio would have been more like 10:1. Holding on to that with my hand would have hurt. ;^)

IMO, we do far worse things to the tranny when we reverse into the slip to slow the boat, than using an impact drive on the nut. Sometimes, mass is your friend... but not when pulling into the slip.

YMMV
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Last edited by ronstory; 04-25-2020 at 11:42 AM. Reason: typo
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Old 04-25-2020, 08:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ndutton View Post
Have you seen the MMI YouTube video on the subject?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fslgwjnuQc
I missed that one. Thanks a bunch.
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Old 04-25-2020, 08:11 PM
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Is there any reference to a list of things to go over? I took off the carb. Probably want a rebuild kit. I took off the water pump, it's pretty shot. I took off the hoses, they were shot. So that's all pretty basic stuff. Now I'm coming up on installing the walter v drive. Looks like it just bolts right up. But I just went down to the boat, and I'm thinking well heck what if the v drive doesn't line up to the prop shaft. So I guess I'm looking for some advice or threads on steps to take when installing a motor. I dont think it would be an overhaul because I'm not getting into removing the heads. I really just want to fire it up in my garage just to see if it runs. But I dont want to mess anything up either. Any advice on going about a checklist or a I wish I would have did this thread?
My engine compartment is fairly big, but at the same time I'm trying to do everything I can so I dont wind up twisted like a pretzel working on something I could have done comfortably from my garage.
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Old 05-26-2020, 11:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronstory View Post
Regarding the nut, it's penetrating oil, time, and a good impact driver.

My story (pun intended ) is that I have a bunch of air tools that could take apart just about anything. However, in my garage it took 5-10 mins or so to power up the compressor (loud), get the hoses out, lube the tools and get ready with an impact socket.

Then I saw this offer from HD on an cordless impact wrench that used all my same Ridgid batteries. After looking at all the reviews, I bought one.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/RIDGID-1...11SB/303037082

Holy Mother of your preferred deity, IT'S AMAZING!! I say that lightly. I was trying to remove the exact same bolt from an unbolted bearing and housing assembly from my "Puzzle rebuild". I wrapped a rag round it to limit it's movement, grabbed it and put the bigass socket on it...and pressed the trigger. I took almost 10 seconds before it started to move and 5 secs longer... it was off.

It's not often I say that a new tool changed how I use tools... this one has. If you can afford $150, just buy one.

Just my opinionated two cents.
I wound up grabbing one from harbor freight. The nut came off instantly
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Old 05-26-2020, 11:38 PM
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Yes, they are amazing and I love mine. It has allowed me to avoid deploying the dreaded cheater pipe many times. ;^)
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Old 05-27-2020, 09:43 PM
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Same..I stood on my breaker bar plus pipe and could not break it loose. It took longer to run the extension cord for the air compressor than it took the impact gun to break it loose (8 years ago before battery powered impacts were common.)
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Old 05-28-2020, 02:37 PM
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ya, it was quite nice. Now I'm working on getting the motor out. problem is i rent a slip at a dock at a house. Id try the boom + chain lift removal but getting it through their side yard wouldn't be manageable> guess where I live its expensive. My best quote is a little under $600 for the removal of the old engine and the new engine to go in.
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Old 05-28-2020, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
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ya, it was quite nice. Now I'm working on getting the motor out. problem is i rent a slip at a dock at a house. Id try the boom + chain lift removal but getting it through their side yard wouldn't be manageable> guess where I live its expensive. My best quote is a little under $600 for the removal of the old engine and the new engine to go in.
I moved mine out with boom and the main sheet line, with my father in law. Went OK. We dropped it into one of these marina "plastic cart", then dragged it up the inclined dock to ground level; it was pretty light for the application, but worked OK. If you have to go across a private yard, it is feasible, but you need a solid cart without small wheel. I put in back in with the yard crane 125$, but I was alone in the boat to receive it... Whatever you do, do not use the hook on top of the engine, unless it is a modified / improved one.
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Old 05-28-2020, 09:17 PM
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Also (I'm sure you thought of this) stripping it down to it's lowest form will make it MUCH easier to man-handle.
(Carb, Starter, Alternator, etc)
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