Water pump seal replacement question

[Outaouais sailor]

I have a leak from the weep hole under my water pump. I have ordered news seals and downloaded Don's helpful instructions.
The part arrives tomorrow and I'm ready to tackle this EXCEPT ...
I don't know if I need to remove the pump, which sounds like it might be tricky, to change the seals.
What say the experts?

[BunnyPlanet169]

I can't imagine not removing it.

But you're correct - getting it off can be a struggle as well. The lower bolt can be especially awful, especially if the head is a little (or more) corroded.

If you haven't got one yet, I personally love the extended lower bolt as available from MMI. http://www.moyermarine.com/cgi-bin/s...key=CSOB_10_89

[Outaouais sailor]

No way to take out the seals leaving it on?
I have horrible access to the back of the motor.
ugh.

[JOHN COOKSON]

Yes, you will need to remove the pump from the engine and get it on the bench.
I've never seen the video so I don't know what is in it. Here's a few helpful hints - may be duplicate information.
To remove the old seals bend a cheap o screwdriver blade to 90 degrees and use it to pull the old seals out. Don't scratch the bore.
Put the new seals in the freezer for a spell and take them to the work area between a couple cakes of frozen blue ice. It will make it easier to get them started squarely.
Brass is soft so work on a wood surface.
I put a bit of waterproof grease on the shaft and twist it through the seals.
You may need to prime the rebuilt pump after you install it.
MMI sells an extension bolt to go in the lower hole on the flange. Makes removing and installing the pump much easier.
More if I think of it.

TRUE GRIT

[JOHN COOKSON]

No way to take out the seals leaving it on?
I have horrible access to the back of the motor.
ugh.

I always suspected they built boats around the engine!
What make and model of boat? Maybe someone in the form has a boat like it and can offer some tips.

TRUE GRIT

Wear a long sleeve shirt. Wait till you get so dizzy you can't figure out which what way is clockwise\counterclockwise to tighten\loosen a bolt or screw. Are we having fun yet?

[Outaouais sailor]

It's a 1976 Ranger 33.
Access to the rear of the engine is through a sliding access panel on the starboard side, where the pilot berth is. I am thinking about putting an access panel in the floor of the cockpit.

[thatch]

The advice you have recieved so far is all good but, you might want to think in terms of the bigger picture and consider the best way to gain better access to everything else in that area. On a previous boat, A Catalina 27, I increased the starboard quarter-berth panel size as much as possible which gave me far better access to everything at the rear of the engine, the trans, the stuffing box, the coupler, etc. A little more work in the beginning may pay dividends in the long run.
Tom

[Outaouais sailor]

Ugh. Struggled with it for an hour today. Couldn't bulge either bolt.
Time to blast them with some penetrating oil overnight and try again tomorrow.

[Easy Rider]

I have a leak from the weep hole under my water pump. I have ordered news seals and downloaded Don's helpful instructions.
The part arrives tomorrow and I'm ready to tackle this EXCEPT ...
I don't know if I need to remove the pump, which sounds like it might be tricky, to change the seals.
What say the experts?

I make no claims to be an "expert" but I have changed the seals a few times over the years and you will definitely have to remove the pump to change the seals. I'm not familiar with the engine access on the Ranger 33 but I have a Ranger 29 which could have a similar access and I couldn't imagine any other way to do this job than to approach the engine from the aft end. In my case this means going down there head first which is awkward but gives you good access and you can see what you're doing. Planning your move ahead of time with the proper tools will make the job less frustrating. The first time with the inside bolt was a struggle but once that was replaced with the extended bolt removing the pump is easy. I even remove the pump to change the impellor. Changing the seals takes a little more care and I would recommend doing it on a bench. Having something like a vise available makes it a lot easier to press in the new seals. I just couldn't imagine doing it any other way. For me the hardest part is removing the old seals. But I did say I wasn't an expert.

[JOHN COOKSON]

Ugh. Struggled with it for an hour today. Couldn't bulge either bolt.
Time to blast them with some penetrating oil overnight and try again tomorrow.

Tap the bolts with whatever you can tap with after you apply the penetrating oil. It will help it penetrate more.

TRUE GRIT

[sail_flathead_lake]

I've done this job on our Ranger 33 and will be doing it again later this year (damn used pump). I remove the quarterberth cushion, then go in through the compartment just behind the battery compartment. I cut a large access hole from that compartment into the engine room, and it makes the job doable.

Best of luck.

[roadnsky]

What is the pump? Oberdorfer? MMI 502?

I have a '78 Ranger 30 and my SB engine room access is a 12"X24" hatch.
I'm pretty average sized and can get my head, shoulders and both arms in there.
IF I couldn't, as Thatch and Sail Flathead suggested, I'd seriously consider modifying that access.
There is a LOT back there you need access to on a regular basis.
Shaft, Stuffing Box, Fuel Tank, Dizzy, Coil, Reversing Gear, Dipstick, Exhaust, WATER PUMP, etc...

Also, GET THE LOWER BOLT.

[JDK]

After recently doing mine I would say I can't imagine having gotten it all cleaned up, decorroded, and such without having had it off.....putting it on and off the engine was easy enough, just two fittings plus the two hoses, however getting into a position to reach them all was a painful challenge on my boat....

[JOHN COOKSON]

This Might Help A Bit

If you can get the lower bolt just a little bit loose then completely remove the upper bolt you will be able to swing the pump on the lower bolt and gain more access.
Ditto for the reinstall. Put the upper bolt in first but leave it loose so you can swing the pump on it. It will be easier to get the lower bolt started. Have the threads on the bolts and accessory drive squeaky clean so you can twist the bolts with your fingers.
Remember to use a 6 point socket or a box wrench when removing so you don't round the heads of the bolts.

TRUE GRIT

[Outaouais sailor]

Thanks for the responses!
Darn bolts are still seized.
I am afraid if I keep yanking at them I will round the heads.
The top one is designed so you can't get a ratchet head on it.
I am thinking about going at it with a torch.