facet pump mysteries

[SimonP]

I opened up my facet fuel pump today, and discovered that the black *washer* around what I take to be the intake valve (see pic) was soft and gummy and I could pick bits off with my fingernail. Since this is downstream of the last filter it may explain my recent carb problems ! What is this washer for, and how can I get a replacement - if I need it?

There is an odd clip around this assemble, again: what is it for?

The big washer in the 'base' was hard and cracking around its inside edge - I found a service kit online with one and a filter, I'm surprised Moyer dopes not carry fuel pump service kits.

I noted the magnet which sits in the 'base', any idea what it does?

Lastly, I note that my pump (fitted before I got the boat) (see other pic) is marked 'automotive' and does not seem to have the part number Don recommends. Is this correct? Is it a big issue?

thanks to anyone who can shed some light on these little mysteries.

[rigspelt]

Somewhere, and I cannot find URL to the thread now, Don has a Tech Tip explaining that some Facet pumps issues prior to the current E-series had a significant failure rate, and that the current E-series pumps are much more reliable. See http://www.moyermarine.com/facet.htm. I don't know how one would confirm whether a pump was in that category. He concluded that the best model for most A4s was 477-060E.

Pesonal styles vary on this point, but not being a mechanic I tend to replace critical individual parts like this rather than try to rebuild them. My rebuild experience for parts like this has not been good (unlike some other people), and my thinking is that if the part is so old that such difficulties are appearing, then perhaps there are other aging features in the part that are not apparent and waiting to surface. I can't find a lot of information using Google about rebuilding these Facet pumps, which makes me wonder if it is recommended.

YMMV

[ghaegele]

Simon, that is a gasket around what I imagine to be a pressure regulating ball valve. It's failure may cause an increase in pressure which I do not believe will be that significant.

I don't know what you mean by an "odd clip" but I have noticed the magnet and believe it is to attract any bits of metal that may be floating in your gas and prevent them from flowing upstream.

Finally, having two fuel pumps on board is not a bad idea. Given the age of yours and the issues (which do seem to have been resolved) with shut-downs, might as well get a new one and keep this one as a spare. But probably this pump will keep working for the life of your engine. Probably.

[tenders]

I think the magnet is to pull rust dust out of the fuel stream before it gets pushed through into the carb and engine.

[SimonP]

tenders :
Magnet to pick up metal grit sounds right, but its on the *inside* of the filter ??? I thought it might pull down the pressure regulator 'button'

ghaegele:
Simon, that is a gasket around what I imagine to be a pressure regulating ball valve. It's failure may cause an increase in pressure which I do not believe will be that significant.

hmmm, I may just pull it out then. I noticed it was gone on my older pump.

>I don't know what you mean by an "odd clip"

in the picture, its around the housing of the pressure regulating ball valve, outside the washer I'm referring to.

rigspelt:
>Don has a Tech Tip explaining that some Facet pumps issues prior to the current E-series had a significant failure rate, and that the current E-series pumps are much more reliable. See http://www.moyermarine.com/facet.htm.

> I don't know how one would confirm whether a pump was in that category. He concluded that the best model for most A4s was 477-060E.

yuh, I had read that, hence my question about models:

exactly - no obvious part numbers...except 574A. and it says 'automotive' as opposed to 'marine' - I think I'll call facet/purolator

later!

[SimonP]

FYI - facet purolator currently list a bunch of 12v pumps, including the 477060E.

http://www.facet-purolator.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=category&sectionid=7&id=14&Itemid=36

(scroll down)

interestingly, there is a 40002E, same specs, with positive shut-off.

No sign of my 574A, but

http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/atomic4/atomic4specs.htm

cites it as the standard pump.

BTW, this is a nice document - check it out


SP

[SimonP]

news from facet-purolator

I spoke with someone at facet-purolator who denied 574A was a valid part number! (I guess there's no reason why an employee giving technical advice should know the names of his companies products, but it would be reassuring

He transferred me to his supervisor who, among other things, told me that:
1. There is no difference between automotive and marine pumps.
2. Ethanol and fuel additives will dissolve the (buna) o-ring. Since a lot of us use sta-bil, etc not to mention carb cleaning fuel additives, this is a bit of a worry.
3. He said a viton o-ring would be resistant, but couldn't supply one, nor even a replacement buna o-ring.
4. He also said the 'clip' holds down a retaining washer, of which there is no trace on either of my facet pumps. (Where did it go?) But they can't supply that either.

I'm waiting for some more info from them...

[Esgbradford]

He transferred me to his supervisor who, among other things, told me that:
1. There is no difference between automotive and marine pumps.
2. Ethanol and fuel additives will dissolve the (buna) o-ring. Since a lot of us use sta-bil, etc not to mention carb cleaning fuel additives, this is a bit of a worry.
3. He said a viton o-ring would be resistant, but couldn't supply one, nor even a replacement buna o-ring.
4. He also said the 'clip' holds down a retaining washer, of which there is no trace on either of my facet pumps. (Where did it go?) But they can't supply that either.

I'm waiting for some more info from them...

Hi all. Sorry to revive an old thread, but the last post is inconclusive... Does any one know what the inner diameter and cross-section diameter is of the o-ring that gets disolved away?

I found www.oringwarehouse.com on the internet. They have Viton o-rings, calling it FKM. Their prices seem pretty good. For example, a o-ring that it Viton based, and has 10.77 mm (+-.13m) inner diameter and 2.62mm (+-.08mm) crosssection, part number AS568-111 is only 9 cents each. You all could do a group buy to get new viton o-rings and for your facet pumps.

I say "you" instead of "we" because I still have a mechanical pump. :-(

Eric
Newport 27
Portland OR

[Tripaddle]

574A I've read is the UL number

In case anyone reads older post I thought I would add this.