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  #26   IP: 134.41.100.227
Old 03-28-2021, 03:24 PM
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OK what does the plug look like. Is it clean. The only other reason I can think of a misfire, with a clean plugs, is a hole in the exhaust manifold. I had that problem 14 years ago. What I did was turn off the raw water intake valve and have someone standby to open it. Cleaned all the plugs, then started the engine let it run for 30 seconds or so...mine ran perfect...had my buddy open the valve and she started to rattle. Steam was trying to put the fire out in the top end of mine, both 3 and 4. It's an easy check.
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  #27   IP: 47.142.136.120
Old 03-28-2021, 07:40 PM
JOHN COOKSON JOHN COOKSON is online now
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Quote:
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Today I think I'll put the old plate with the traditional points back in in place of the EI, just in case that helps..
IMO this is a good idea.

ex TRUE GRIT
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  #28   IP: 69.250.109.188
Old 03-28-2021, 08:29 PM
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I've found this tool to be very handy. You put it inline between a spark plug and that plug's wire, and there will be a visible spark inside the tool to confirm that your spark plug is is getting fired (but whether it's actually sparking or not depends on the proper gap etc).

It's called an inline spark tester. Amazon has several for less than $10:

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  #29   IP: 75.172.43.123
Old 03-28-2021, 10:10 PM
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I went to the auto store and bought the spark plug tester, very nice, a tidy way to test. Each of the 4 plugs made the same flashing light result. Also did the water off/on test suggested by Mo above and heard/felt no difference at all. Took a usb snake camera to the aftmost plug hole and examined raised exhaust valve and stem, and then tried the allen wrench trick. It has had a lot of MMO, even a bit of WD40, in it. No movement. Turned the engine a bit and tried again. I've run out of ideas.
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  #30   IP: 104.174.83.118
Old 03-28-2021, 11:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DDO View Post
I've run out of ideas.
This isn't going to get better until the offending valve becomes unstuck. If you've exhausted (intended, sorry) the non-invasive methods that, depending on the severity of the stuck-ness, have not been successful you are left with partial engine disassembly, head, manifold, valve cover plate and valve removal, valve guide reaming and possible replacement as well as possible valve replacement.

At that point a decision needs to be made. As long as the engine is disassembled that far, as long as you've already ordered replacement head, valve cover, thermostat (if late model), manifold, exhaust flange and carburetor gaskets, as long as you have the valve spring compressor handy, do you address just the one stuck valve or go nuclear and do all eight? How often do you get in that deep? It's a question no one can answer but you.
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DDO (03-30-2021)
  #31   IP: 69.250.109.188
Old 03-29-2021, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DDO View Post
It has had a lot of MMO, even a bit of WD40, in it.
Have you tried something with better penetration, like PB Blaster or an acetone/oil mix? You need something that will fight its way down along the valve stem.
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  #32   IP: 165.225.20.153
Old 03-29-2021, 06:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DDO View Post
...... Each of the 4 plugs made the same flashing light result. ..... I've run out of ideas.
So if I recap:
- compression in cylinder 3 OK: no valve blocked
- cylinders 1 & 2 running: so air / gas is actually mixing and getting into the manifold, AND no major back-pressure on the exhaust
- change in engine operation when you remove the plug cable on 1 & 2: so your timing should be OK
- entire new ignition system + plug tester OK on all 4 plugs+wires: all ignition system OK

Now we are really getting in the weird / difficult... So I apologize for asking it, especially as it was already mentioned before on that thread, but before you start pulling head and manifold out, I have to ask: are you 100% sure you have not mixed up cables 3 & 4 in relation to 1243 and not 1234 order? Have you tried to swap 3 & 4, just for peace of mind?
Once again, I am very humble in asking it, as it is rare to have a engine mixing air and fuel, making spark, with correct timing, no back-pressure on the exhaust, and not firing on that cylinder (exactly as you say: running out of ideas)
PS: do not ask me why I insist on that one, I got a very late night revelation when doing my overhaul, when I could not have the engine purr properly...

Good luck
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Last edited by Surcouf; 03-29-2021 at 09:49 AM. Reason: typo
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  #33   IP: 75.172.43.123
Old 03-30-2021, 12:48 AM
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I dropped the old points/condenser plate into the distributor and all behavior exactly the same btw. I have seen the aftmost exhaust valve up, see the stem with the camera. Still can't move it. I've checked the 1243 so many times and made others come look too -- so that will probably be it in the end, ha ha. I did not use acetone (yet). I am removing the manifold and valve cover and I'm going to stare at it all opened up for awhile. I have the new exhaust flange and pressure kit, the first part in the eventual update of the exhaust system, and a new manifold to install -- I have no idea why that appealed to me. I'll report anything interesting I find; thanks all for all the tests and suggestions.
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Old 03-30-2021, 01:09 AM
JOHN COOKSON JOHN COOKSON is online now
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I don't know where I'm going with this...... but anyway.

Does the #3 spark plug smell of unburned gasoline after no start cranking?
Is there a possibility of #3 intake valve being stuck closed? You'll find out when you get the valve cover removed.

ex TRUE GRIT
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  #35   IP: 165.225.20.153
Old 03-30-2021, 03:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHN COOKSON View Post
Is there a possibility of #3 intake valve being stuck closed? .
ex TRUE GRIT
Valve closed? interesting idea as it would explain why gas does not get in, but that would mean that either the camshaft, pusher or the valve stem is doomed

sorry for the 1234/1243, it is likely the end of it (the easiest is to swap both lines )
Good luck for dissassembly
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A nostalgic PO - Previously "Almost There" - Catalina 27 (1979)

Last edited by Surcouf; 03-30-2021 at 05:34 AM.
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  #36   IP: 108.79.1.46
Old 03-31-2021, 04:06 PM
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I apologize if someone has already covered this, but you could try swapping the #3 plug with a known good plug; maybe you got a bad one.
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  #37   IP: 75.172.61.96
Old 04-06-2021, 12:17 AM
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Just to follow up, I pulled apart the engine and am working to free the stuck valve, so I started a new thread "valves revealed" for that problem. I felt that I had to pull the head, manifold, and valve cover, which wasn't too difficult, to focus on that stuck valve and find a cause. So "shake shake shake" is now understood to be stuck-stuck-stuck. Thanks all for the many troubleshooting ideas.
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Old 04-07-2021, 10:14 PM
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Lightbulb

DDO..5 (or 20) years from now, someone may stumble on this thread...I recommend posting the link to your new thread so they can follow the updates.
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  #39   IP: 97.113.109.145
Old 04-08-2021, 12:05 AM
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Yup, I thought it a good idea to put the "valves revealed" search string instead of the link, since links all over this site broke when Moyer re-hosted and I'm a software engineer expecting that sort of thing to happen, ha ha. Link https://www.moyermarineforum.com/for...ad.php?t=11853
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sastanley (04-10-2021)
  #40   IP: 69.250.111.245
Old 04-10-2021, 12:06 AM
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Thumbs up

+1 - software engineer here too. I have my 2009 newbie thread with a lot of broken links when the site was re-hosted. We do what we can..
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Old 04-10-2021, 06:53 AM
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Many of the broken links can still be accessed if you change this in the post on the original host:

moyermarine.com/forums/xxxxxxx

To this:

moyermarineforum.com/forums/xxxxxx

Bill
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  #42   IP: 69.250.109.188
Old 04-11-2021, 10:24 AM
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Many of the broken links can still be accessed if you change this in the post on the original host...
Sounds like a great job for a little script run on the database.
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