I know it shouldn't look like peanut butter

[team118]

I had an issue last winter and did a poor job of winterizing A-4

I have a 1977 Catalina 30.

I was getting water in oil and kept an eye on it last year.

This spring, I redid the entire top sides but a week into sailing her, the A-4 starting spitting milky oil out of the breather cap into the bilge. It was a mess.

I took her out and they found a cracked manifold, which was replaced. Unfortunately, it must have been more than that.

I took her out for the season and was at least hoping to get rid of the watery oil for the winter in anticipation of the yard working on her.

The oil isn't even oil any more. It is the consistency of whipped butter. I cannot siphon it and I am at a loss of what to do. We're in Rochester, NY and the yard doesn't have tons of experience with A-4's.

I'm just sick....and can't even think about the cost of a re-power on a 43 year old boat.

Would diesel or an engine sludge remover work?

Thanks for any thoughts
Chris

[Peter]

Chris,

I think I would pressure test the cooling system before investing a lot of time cleaning that goop out.

You can do the block and the manifold separately. If the block does not hold pressure then that engines days are done.

If block holds pressure then the cleanup is a worthwhile effort.

Advice on getting the froth out. Most strategies involve

1) suck out everything that you can
2) put in cheap oil
3) run till warm
4) oil still milky? If Yes Then back to 1)

If a re-power is needed there are used A4’s around.

Good luck,

Peter

[zellerj]

To clean out your block of that goo, I would try this:

This is a mixture of oil and and water that has been mixed to form an emulsion. You need something that dissolves both water and oil. This means you need to be more polar than oii, and less polar than water. One solvent that fits this bill is isopropanol, which you can buy pretty cheap Get the highest concentration stuff that you can find.

Another solvent that fits this bill is acetone, which can dissolve both water and oil.


Once the isopropanol or acetone is in the engine block, you need a way to mix it. Try bumping your starter a few times.

About 2 gallons of each should do the job. I would do it twice, once for a rinse. Then add cheap oil and do an oil change after running it for a few minutes.

[ndutton]

I'm so sorry to see this Chris. It's impossible to be completely accurate from a picture but my gut tells me a few things:

• I'd be surprised if that level of water incursion came from just a manifold breach.
• Did I read correctly this happened AFTER the manifold was replaced?
• As mentioned by Peter, a cooling system pressure test is needed but if it passes I don't know how accurate the test can be with a block full of whipped butter. I'd suggest doing the pressure test in situ. If it fails the block is done. If it passes, remove the engine, take it home to muck it out and pressure test again. There is no point in spending a nickel on an engine with a breach.
• Be very careful with volatile solvents in the engine, out of the engine, in the shop or even in the neighborhood.
• Explore your options thoroughly. Moyer offers replacements in a variety of stages from bare blocks to complete engines and everything in between and there is always the used engine market.
• The expense your boat needs at this time makes no financial sense (you know that already) but just owning a boat doesn't either (you also know that).

[team118]

[*]The expense your boat needs at this time makes no financial sense (you know that already) but just owning a boat doesn't either (you also know that).


Thank you for your thoughts....the last bullet. Doesn't that just hit home.

I've had the boat for at least 10 years....wouldn't be worth more that $8 or 9k with the engine working...in this state...it's unsellable...so freaking sad.


I will try the iso or acetone, get the sludge out as best I can and let the boat yard will do their pressure tests (which they should have done before, but didn't).

Thank you
Chris

[joe_db]

All of that is a waste of time until the block is pressure tested. I suspect it is cracked

[ndutton]

Reality check

and let the boat yard will do their pressure tests (which they should have done before, but didn't)

You're right Chris, they should have and the bigger question is why didn't they? For me, if this is the kind of half-arsed work they do I wouldn't be so quick to go back to them for more.

You can do the preliminary pressure test yourself easily and when it fails as we all suspect it will you'll have a direction to take. As for the yard, I'm not impressed.

Remember, we do this for the love. Finances be damned (to a point).

[Dave Neptune]

Chris, if you replaced the manifold and this happened again means something else is bad. I see no mention of a compression test to see if it is a simple head-gasket. If the compression numbers are OK then it is time to pressure test the block.

Another possibility is this~~over cranking (hard to start) with the seacock open. This can allow water to back up into the exhaust and get through an open exhaust valve to the cylinder. Has this been done? Even a bad anti-syphon valve can do this too, worth a check.

Do not use acetone or alcohol inside the engine or engine compartment !!!!! To risky for fumes going BOOM! You don't need to dissolve it you need to thin for extraction. Will she start? If so add about a quart of diesel fuel, run for a few minutes to warm then extract. Then add cheap oil and repeat the warm and extract procedure.

Dave Neptune

[JOHN COOKSON]

"MAYONASIE" REMOVAL MADE EASY

Attach a tap in place of the oil pressure sending unit. Hook a length of tubing onto the tap and direct it into a jug. Start the engine and open the tap. Stop the engine and add a equivalent amount of diesel or oil to the engine. (one quart at a time maybe) Repeat until the diesel\oil runs clear. You could always try cheap oil first rather than diesel and see how works.

ex TRUE GRIT

[team118]

You're right Chris, they should have and the bigger question is why didn't they? For me, if this is the kind of half-arsed work they do I wouldn't be so quick to go back to them for more.

You can do the preliminary pressure test yourself easily and when it fails as we all suspect it will you'll have a direction to take. As for the yard, I'm not impressed.

Remember, we do this for the love. Finances be damned (to a point).

Yeah, very little experience with A-4's. No excuse and perhaps they should have done the research. Probably saw the cracked manifold, replaced it along with all the gaskets and assumed they fixed the problem.

The marina owner has always been an upfront business man and has a good and fair reputation in our area. He is going to go over engine Monday and has committed to making it right.

I want to thank everyone and will be printing this thread out along with Moyer's various 'stickys' over water in the oil and pressure testing techniques.

Removing the oil sending unit with a tube is a very interesting thought!!!!

Again, my thanks!

[joe_db]

Attach a tap in place of the oil pressure sending unit. Hook a length of tubing onto the tap and direct it into a jug. Start the engine and open the tap. Stop the engine and add a equivalent amount of diesel or oil to the engine. (one quart at a time maybe) Repeat until the diesel\oil runs clear. You could always try cheap oil first rather than diesel and see how works.

ex TRUE GRIT

I would use a big bottle of MMO vs. the diesel myself, but YMMV.

[JOHN COOKSON]

If you can't clear the oil or there is evidence of water insurrection again there is another problem somewhere - I have a feeling this is the case.
Cracked block, water pump seal, head gasket, exhaust system problem, etc.

ex TRUE GRIT

[Al Schober]

Wow! Never seen a mess like that. Guess there's always a first time.
Do the pressure test of the block first. If it fails, just clean up the parts you want to save.

[edwardc]

I've had good luck using kerosene or varsol to flush out oil in this state.