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  #1   IP: 68.173.42.115
Old 05-13-2017, 02:58 PM
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Oil Safety Switch (3wire) wiring connections/ replacement?

Does anyone know which wire goes to which terminal on the old 3 wire design?

Everything ran fine on basically the first attempt this spring (after carb rebuild, RWC pump rebuild, cleaning out the thermostat housing and mostly clogged up bypass line, replaced rusted/ stuck choke cable, plugs, wires, Delco distributer cap and rotor). Decide to pressure flush and acid wash, the original galvanized 1/8"NPT 6" nipple broke off from the aft drain plug, which led to distributer removal, tapping and replacing with a brass nipple... Everything back together and ended up pinching the ignitor wire when replacing the rotor cap when setting the timing. After a fun filled afternoon with no spark or voltage at the coil, looks like 2 of the wires on the oil pressure safety switch had loose corroded connections, decided to cut, strip and replace all of the connectors (forgot to label them as it was getting dark and just wanted to get her running again).

There are lots of posts on eliminating the wire to the 'R' terminal on the starter and plenty of schematics with the two terminal switch. After a little cleaning it looks like terminals 1 and 3 are normally closed (continuity test between the two). So I would think that the starter would go to one of those and fuel pump (electric) to the other and coil to no. 2? It is a V drive (mounted backwards) and mounted up near the flywheel. So I can either attach a meter to verify what terminals do what on cranking (with RW through hull closed) and see what terminals do what with oil pressure or just replace it with the two wire switch (not getting consistent readings on the terminals now). Eliminate the R wire to the starter, and maybe move it to where the mechanical fuel pump was, move the electric fuel pump to that plate, add an inline filter (have the water separator type before the fuel pump, both mounted on the bulkhead under the galley sink locker), and plug the current oil port or leave the oil pressure sender there. This would just make things more accessible and hopefully a cleaner install. Would also add a switch to bypass the oil safety sw, or maybe 2, one momentary for priming and one manual for emergency run if necessary.

The PO always used a starting spray on each start up (cold), hence the carb work, choke cable, etc, I want to have her start up and run with out any assistance. So I am picking up a new pertonix ignitor (pinched insulation on the positive lead, which grounded to the plate and blew a 30A fuse which I now know where that is) and headed over to install that as soon as this rain passes. I insulated the insulation with heat shrink, no blown fuse and 12.4V at the coil (no shore power on a mooring), still no spark. Not from the secondary of the coil lead to the block and obviously not from any of the other leads. The primary of the coil is still 4.0 ohms when disconnected. I currently have the fuel pump jumped to the ignition switch and debating a replacement coil along with the above changes. Any suggestions on the above 'enhancements' or other ideas? It would be great to confirm what wire goes where on that switch or a part number for a replacement switch I can pick up locally to get this taken care of this weekend would be great! First year with this boat and just want reliable auxiliary power for when the wind dies down and navigating a busy channel/ mooring. Thanks.
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Last edited by DaveMac; 05-13-2017 at 06:44 PM.
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  #2   IP: 73.28.211.141
Old 05-13-2017, 10:40 PM
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A typical 3 wire would have one terminal that went to the idiot light. That would mean that with no oil pressure it would be grounded. With oil pressure it would not be grounded and thus the idiot light would go off.

With the other 2 terminals, they make connection with oil pressure, so they would run the fuel pump.
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Old 05-14-2017, 10:10 AM
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This is one kind:
http://www.jegs.com/installationinst.../555-11200.pdf

It is designed to feed the fuel pump when the engine is being cranked but pressure is still low.
I have another kind that does both OPSS and low oil pressure warning duties. I'll see if I can dig up that diagram.
I have the Standard PS64 switch. The outer two terminals connect together when pressure is up. This is the OPSS part. The center one grounds when there is no pressure, this one runs the alarm or warning light.
You'll have to do a little detective work with a meter or reading part numbers to see which kind you have. You will have issues if you think you have one kind and really have another, at the least you would risk blowing a fuse.

Last edited by joe_db; 05-14-2017 at 10:22 AM.
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Old 05-14-2017, 10:43 AM
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Whether you keep this switch or replace it, those quick connect terminals are bad form. They risk loosening over time making the connection unreliable. Screws with star lock washers holding closed ring terminals are ABYC compliant.

Quote:
ABYC 11.16.3.4.
"Terminal connectors shall be the ring or captive spade types.”
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  #5   IP: 97.32.66.56
Old 05-14-2017, 06:37 PM
Ken Rockwell Ken Rockwell is offline
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First hook a wire from the positive battery terminal to the positive coil terminal. And it should start. Remember disconnecting this wire is the only way to shut it off.
You're oil switch should have one hot coming in and two hot coming out. When the pressure is low the current travels to the low pressure light and when presure is high it travels to the coil. Your engine builds more than enough pressure with the starter.
So get a test light and connect one end to ground, turn on the key, and see which wire is hot. Next connect the jumper from the positive terminal of the battery to one of the other two wires. One will start the engine the other will not.
To test the switch hook a positive jumper to any terminal and use the test light and see if it works the way I described. There are only six combinations.
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Old 05-15-2017, 08:21 AM
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Like I said - only SOME of them are wired that way. Mine is most definitely NOT.
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Old 05-15-2017, 09:43 AM
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Then it's wrong. Either way there's only six combinations, you won't fry anything, its just a switch. And it only works one way
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Old 05-15-2017, 09:52 AM
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Thank you all for the input so far, I am traveling for work this week and will not make it back down to the water until Friday. I will let you all know how it goes and what I find this weekend!
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Old 05-15-2017, 10:52 AM
JOHN COOKSON JOHN COOKSON is offline
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One terminal is power to the switch. Two terminals are power out of the switch. Which are which?
When there is no oil pressure the power to the switch terminal and one other terminal are connected. Use an ohm meter to find these two terminals.
Bypass the switch and start the engine. One of the two terminals previously identified will be connected to the third terminal inside the switch. Use an ohm meter to find this terminal. There will be zero ohms between the power in terminal and the power out terminal when the oil pressure is up. To confirm take another reading between the power in terminal and the power out terminal when the oil pressure is zero. This will be an open circuit.

TRUE GRIT
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Old 05-15-2017, 11:20 AM
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You would fry something if you had my switch. The center terminal is grounded with 0 oil pressure, so feeding 12 volts into that would be a dead short.
To test, if you have my type, at 0 oil pressure, the outer two contacts have no connection to anything and the center contact should be 0 ohms to ground. Running with oil pressure up, the outer 2 have 0 ohms between each other and the center one has no connection to ground or the other two. The other kind also has 3 terminals, but none of them ever connect to ground. Pressure at 0 and the center should connect to one side and pressure on it connects to the other.


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Originally Posted by Ken Rockwell View Post
Then it's wrong. Either way there's only six combinations, you won't fry anything, its just a switch. And it only works one way
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Old 05-15-2017, 01:11 PM
JOHN COOKSON JOHN COOKSON is offline
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I was assuming nothing was connected to the switch as shown in post #1.
Different situations would call for different strategies.

TRUE GRIT
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Old 05-15-2017, 03:28 PM
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I would start with totally bypassing it to make sure there are no other issues, and then with the engine running and not running do a truth table with all the resistances between terminals and to ground filled out.
YMMV
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Old 05-15-2017, 05:59 PM
Ken Rockwell Ken Rockwell is offline
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Ok he's sending power from the starter, one to ground and another must be to the coil or pump.
Turn the key on and touch the wire from the starter to one of the other two. One will throw a spark, that's ground, the other should pump fuel or make the coil hot.
How's my new theory?
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Old 05-15-2017, 08:15 PM
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Also need to test the PerTronix ignitor as that may have fried with the pinched lead. After a quick call with them this afternoon:

1. Connect the base plate to the negative terminal of the battery
2. Connect the Red lead from the ignitor and Red lead from volt meter to the pos '+' battery terminal
3. Connect the Black lead from the ignitor to the black lead from the voltmeter
4. You should see battery voltage
5. Rotate the magnet and voltage should drop to 1-2 volts, if it stays steady then the ignitor will need to be replaced with PerTronix 1146A. If that is the case, then looks like I will be giving Ken another call!

With the OPSS jumped out (fuel pump runs with ignition on) I did get battery voltage at the coil and no spark (Coil output to the block), so may also be looking at a new coil. This one has 4.0 ohms on the primary, I wouldn't think the other issues would impact the secondary of the coil, yet there is no spark. Will have a whole new ignition system by the time I get this sorted out!
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Old 05-16-2017, 08:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveMac View Post
Will have a whole new ignition system by the time I get this sorted out!
Yep, often par for the course. Ignition components are connected to each other and when bad things happen it propagates through the system literally at the speed of light.
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Old 05-16-2017, 04:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ndutton View Post
Whether you keep this switch or replace it, those quick connect terminals are bad form. They risk loosening over time making the connection unreliable. Screws with star lock washers holding closed ring terminals are ABYC compliant.
They (whoever they are) say you learn something new each day. I had no idea about the terminals. Thanks Neil
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Old 05-16-2017, 04:19 PM
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Common switches I've seen are labeled:

I = Ignition switch
S = Starter
P = Pump
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Old 05-16-2017, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sglazebrook View Post
Common switches I've seen are labeled:

I = Ignition switch
S = Starter
P = Pump
That is this kind:
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Old 05-18-2017, 08:05 PM
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I wouldn't mind powering up the fuel pump if it was fuel injected but, my engine runs without a fuel pump, and there's quite a bit of fuel in the carb. It just makes me nervous. Especially since the pressure switch is already at zero. Now you're going to wait longer for it to shut down.
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Old 05-20-2017, 02:24 PM
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Made it back down to the water yesterday: new coil, ignitor, and checked #1 cylinder at TDC. She fired up on the first crank, runs smoother than I can recall. I still have the OPSS jumped out, will sort that out this week. The new one I picked up is labelled I/S/P, will just confirm with the fluke that those contacts make sense.

Once that is sorted out, I will go back to complete the acid wash and pressure flush which started this whole journey. I'll post the results later this weekend, thank you all for the help in sorting this out!
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