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  #1   IP: 50.49.154.161
Old 10-10-2014, 07:39 AM
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reverse collar slippage

Recently I lost all reverse. I tightened the collar and gained reverse again, but then after a few weeks, no reverse. Is there a way to "hold" the collar after I tighten it? Why would it slip?
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  #2   IP: 142.136.107.234
Old 10-10-2014, 08:40 AM
Dave Neptune Dave Neptune is online now
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7, are you saying you have no reverse or it is slipping in reverse? I could be he linkage and often is!
Remember reverse is accomplished by "holding" it engaged where in forward it locks in place with the detent.
No real sure of he question.

Dave Neptune
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  #3   IP: 24.152.131.153
Old 10-10-2014, 08:48 AM
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There's a brittle spring clip that's intended to keep the adjustment nut from moving. Sounds to me like yours has broken away. If this is the case, at this time they are not available.

It happened to me on my project engine. I looked at the clip crosseyed and it broke. It still had one of the two legs remaining, the MMI manual says it will continue to function that way but that wouldn't do for me. I ended up making a replacement out of 0.091" spring steel music wire.
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Last edited by ndutton; 10-10-2014 at 08:55 AM.
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  #4   IP: 70.27.58.162
Old 10-10-2014, 02:49 PM
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There has to be a better way than that spring wire clip Neil...I see another "wish list" product in the making!

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  #5   IP: 24.152.131.153
Old 10-10-2014, 04:40 PM
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I don't have a problem with the clip design but you're right, there's more than one way to skin a cat. It took me three iterations before I was able to produce a replacement clip. The first one I didn't get the bends tight enough and the symmetry was way off. The second turned out excellent but broke upon installation. I believe my bench top heat treat process turned it as brittle as glass. The third, pictured previously, I eliminated the heat treat process and that's where we are.

My goal is to adjust the band without removing the clip. I want the clip springy enough to expand on the adjusting nut peaks and spring back to hold against the flats. With the Kaminski modification it makes reverse band adjustment a one hand operation.
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Old 10-12-2014, 06:32 AM
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don't have one of those

I don't have one of those spring clips. There is nothing to hold the nut from loosening. However, when I adjusted the forward collar and brake band this spring, the band held for months. It's only recently that the band has loosened.
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  #7   IP: 97.73.48.124
Old 10-12-2014, 08:39 AM
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Neil is correct in pointing out that adjustment of the 3/4" nut is intended to be made with the spring in place. Also, in my experience, if you do have to remove one of these springs for any reason, they are very prone to break during the installation process unless you hold the retaining bolt from turning (even a little bit) with one wrench while tightening the nut on the other end of the bolt. Don
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  #8   IP: 24.152.131.153
Old 10-12-2014, 09:04 AM
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Don,
Do you think a flat washer between the bolt head and the spring clip would make breakage a little less likely?
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prior boats 1987 Westsail 32, 1970 Catalina 22
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  #9   IP: 97.73.48.123
Old 10-12-2014, 12:13 PM
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You would think so Neil, but Universal's (somewhat unlikely) configuration was to use a lock washer between the head of the bolt and the spring and nothing under the nut on the other end of the bolt. I always dutifully (OK, blindly?) followed their lead and never broke another spring. That said, I have to believe that a flat washer would work just as well. Don
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Old 10-12-2014, 01:01 PM
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I'm thinking narrow shoulder flat washer on the spring, split lock washer under the nut on the back side, slightly longer mounting bolt.
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  #11   IP: 97.73.50.118
Old 10-12-2014, 03:27 PM
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Sounds like that should work fine. But again, be sure to hold the bolt firmly as you tighten the nut. Don
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Old 10-12-2014, 03:57 PM
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Got it. No motion allowed on the spring clip side, compression only.

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1977 Catalina 30
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  #13   IP: 70.27.58.162
Old 10-13-2014, 02:24 AM
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I was thinking along the lines of a stainless spring ball plunger held in place by the current wire spring bolt indexing on a stainless 3/4" hex bolt with an integral indexing collar (the collar would have the index holes drilled in the side as opposed to the photo which shows the index holes drilled in the flat).

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Old 10-13-2014, 08:58 AM
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I do have one of those clips

I'm glad I've given occasion to think about the brake band nut and the clip. After more careful inspection, I discovered I do have an intact clip. I suppose I didn't notice it before because I wasn't looking. Also, I noticed that the brake band does hold in reverse quite well. No need to tighten the nut. This brings me to the conclusion that the problem is in my pedestal linkage to the shifting cable. I don't know why this problem would be intermittent.
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Old 10-18-2014, 07:54 PM
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I found a spring that may solve the adjuster breakage issue - from a Norton Commando gearbox...this one won't break but it looks like a collar would be required to center it to the fixing bolt.

The spring in question is the middle spring of the three in the kit.

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Old 10-19-2014, 12:44 AM
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have clip, but have yet to install it

For years now I have had in a drawer one of those spring clips. I got it from the guys at Moyer, they don't usually sell them but had one lying around the shop. I noticed that mine was missing, maybe it broke and is in the bottom of the gearbox, but I couldn't find it. In the meantime I just Jerry-rigged a thick electrical wire from the bolt through the holes in the nut, and it seems to hold it in place well enough. Maybe that's why the nut has holes. Shortly after when I first got the boat 20 years ago, there was no reverse or neutral, that's when I discovered the clip was missing.
Someday I will get around to the proper installation.
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  #17   IP: 68.4.130.53
Old 10-23-2014, 04:26 PM
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DaveNeptune in is previous post on this thread, suggested we have to hold the shifter in reverse, but in forward it detents and holding it is not required.
That is a very clumsy sentence, but I have never heard nor read that the A4 needs to be "held" in reverse. If true, that explains my problems with reverse!!!!
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  #18   IP: 68.60.179.71
Old 10-23-2014, 07:25 PM
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It is definitely true that you have to hold the reverse lever to ensure that the motor stays in reverse. There is no reverse detent.
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Old 10-23-2014, 09:18 PM
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Thanks for the reply, I feel like an idiot, I have been cussin" that reverse "gear" for ever. I thought it was an adjustment issue and I cannot tell you how many times I have gotten "under the hood". I did notice that if I hold the shift lever in reverse, it reverses, like coming into my slip.

It never occurred to me that was normal, and I needed to hold it back to keep it in reverse.

Don, maybe you should remind everybody of this????
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Old 10-24-2014, 11:32 AM
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There is no detent - but if the brake band is adjusted properly you should not have to "hold" it in reverse.

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  #21   IP: 68.4.130.53
Old 10-24-2014, 01:18 PM
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Thanks, 67c&ccorv! All my Moyer manuals are at the boat, but quick question, do you have a source for instructions on adjusting the brake band?

Thank you, Randy
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  #22   IP: 68.4.130.53
Old 10-24-2014, 03:25 PM
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to all, I found the adjustment procedure on-line.

Thx, Randy
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