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  #26   IP: 173.30.41.140
Old 03-21-2018, 11:54 PM
Ram41662 Ram41662 is offline
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Alright, I can see why most coatings are shied away from, but from that circular, it would seem phenol novolac epoxies are acceptable if you follow the manufacturer's instructions. These products are by nature are very adherent to all metals, more surface tolerant to residual oxidation, and are self supporting after curing. Its uses the tank as a type of form until it cures then leaves a complete polymer plastic tank inside the metal tank. I've seen demos where a thin walled tank was cut and peeled away leaving a fully usable plastic tank. They may not be the perfect solution in every case, but appear to solve some problems. The main concern is making sure you apply the material fully to all surfaces and again, follow the manufacurer's instructions religiously. FYI, I've seen horrible failures with elastomeric liners even used by factory trained technicians, so I recommend to everyone to stay away from them.

My reason for asking was I put a bore camera down in my aluminum tank today and found an area of nominal erosion I was a bit concerned about. It's not anywhere near corroding through, but I wanted to make sure no further loss was going to occur in that area so I was planning on lining my tank.

Thanks Neil
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Last edited by Ram41662; 03-22-2018 at 12:03 AM.
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  #27   IP: 24.152.132.140
Old 03-22-2018, 08:59 AM
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For those who may be interested, here are the application instructions for phenol novolac epoxy fuel tank sealer by Caswell http://www.caswellplating.com/epoxy-...kaAoIwEALw_wcB
Quote:
Application Instructions
All traces of oil and gasoline should first be removed by pouring about 1 pint of acetone or lacquer thinner into the tank, and rotating the tank several times to thoroughly sluice the sides with solvent. Dispose of the contaminated solution.

When recoating your gas tank from failed Kreem or POR-15 tank sealers, remove the old, failed coating using a paint stripper containing Methylene Chloride.

Place a hand full of drywall screws into the tank and shake them around vigorously for several minutes. These will dislodge any loose particles of rust. In the case of Fiberglass and plastic tanks, this will rough up the tank interior, improving adhesion.

Rinse out the tank with about 1-pint of acetone or lacquer thinner, then set aside and allow to dry. Use an airline to blow air into the tank to aid drying.

Apply duct tape or masking tape to any weeping seams, holes or porous areas. This will stop any Gas Tank Sealer from oozing out, and will allow it to bridge over the hole. Plug the outlet ports with putty or Play-Doh. Mix up the required amount of Gas Tank Sealer (one unit should treat two small motorcycle tanks or one large one) If you are only treating ONE small tank, then divide parts A & B in half. You could use a dipstick to gauge this.

In a separate plastic container (margarine tub etc.) mix the two parts together thoroughly for at least 2 minutes. Scrape around the sides to ensure all resin is blended together. BAD MIXING AND BAD MEASURING IS THE #1 CAUSE OF FAILURE!!

Pour into the tank, then immediately seal up the filler hole with Gladwrap and an elastic band. Swill the tank around in every direction for several minutes to obtain a good layer of Gas Tank Sealer over all surfaces. Remove the filler cap,Gladwrap seal, and pour out any excess. Allow to drain upside down for a few minutes.
If you have a built in fuel filter, blow air into the fuel line port for about 10 minutes. This will clear the filter of any Gas Tank Sealer.

Scrape off any excess with a sharp knife at this point (usually about 40-60 Min after mixing) Place the tank in a warm 70-90 f place and allow to cure overnight. In the case of alcohol fuels, allow 3-5 days at room temperature, or 24 hours at 120 deg f.
The only comment I'll make is after repairing a fuel tank by any means it should be pressure tested to a minimum of 3 psi including bubble detection following the USCG protocol found on pages 100-103 of this pdf.
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  #28   IP: 137.103.82.194
Old 03-22-2018, 10:33 AM
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I am curious what would be eroding an aluminum tank from the inside out and also if this coating is resistant to ethanol. We would not want to repeat the Bertram disaster where ethanol was dissolving the fuel tanks and making goo that would go right through a Racor and ruin the engine.
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Old 03-22-2018, 04:14 PM
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The only comment I'll make is after repairing a fuel tank by any means it should be pressure tested to a minimum of 3 psi including bubble detection following the USCG protocol found on pages 100-103 of this pdf.[/QUOTE]

I wholeheartedly agree with the pressure testing. The commercial versions all have a series of post-cure test they require before a tank is placed in service.

The brands I'm most familiar with are Carboline and Azko-Noble. I'm not familiar with Caswell's products, but the chemistry is VERY familiar. I will say the commercial guys' surface prep requirements are a bit more "professional" than Caswell's, but then that's to be expected. I would have expected expected at least an etching step. Normally acid for steel, TSP solution for aluminum. Their coating could be self-etching, i have seen some coatings that were.

As for pricing, Caswell's per gallon kit isn't much more than Carboline's, so it seems pretty fair.

Thanks for the info Neil!
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Old 03-22-2018, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joe_db View Post
I am curious what would be eroding an aluminum tank from the inside out and also if this coating is resistant to ethanol. We would not want to repeat the Bertram disaster where ethanol was dissolving the fuel tanks and making goo that would go right through a Racor and ruin the engine.
My etching appears to be caused by slightly acidic water settling out of the tank into the lowest corner. I've seen this happen in other aluminum tanks that were stored with liquids in them for too long.

As for the Bertram incident, what you're describing sounds like one of the types of failure I've seen happen too often with elastomeric liners. They fail WAY to often. I've even seen failures triggered due to something as small as a change from winter to summer fuel blends. Ethanol also like to dissolve into solution elements of the resins used in GRP, which a proper chemical should prevent from happening.

Phenol novolac epoxies come from the petrochemical industry and have been used to line fuel storage tanks, even fuels with ethanol additives, for years. For example, Carboline's "Phenoline" products have a chemical resistance rate listed as: "Ethyl Alcohol, 1 year immersion @ 100°F (38°C) - Unaffected"

That being said, I just sent an email to Caswell for some more info on their product. Once I get it, i'll share what they say. As long as their product is true PNE, then it will work to solve a lot of fuel tank problems.
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Last edited by Ram41662; 03-22-2018 at 04:53 PM.
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  #31   IP: 70.186.109.11
Old 04-01-2018, 06:20 PM
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Just as fyi, since I posted here, I got the old tank out using information provided by Jeff Ashbury.
The dark shade on the right lower corner, is where the leak was.
Now to figure what to put in as a replacement, within the space I have to work with.
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Last edited by CajunSpike; 04-02-2018 at 04:48 PM.
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  #32   IP: 173.30.41.140
Old 04-02-2018, 01:34 AM
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Just quick update: still haven't heard from Caswell. That kind of "quick response" makes me hesitant about their product,
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  #33   IP: 137.103.82.194
Old 04-02-2018, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CajunSpike View Post
Just as fyi, since I posted here, I got the old tank out.
Now to figure what to put in as a replacement, within the space I have to work with.
What are the dimensions?
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  #34   IP: 184.176.196.206
Old 04-02-2018, 04:40 PM
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By direct measurement, the tank is 24 long, 16 wide, 10 high.

Tank I'm replacing with is 24 long, 18.25 wide, 7.5 high.

Will be a plastic 12 gallon Moeller product.
Price was just over $200.

Found 3 holes in the starboard rear lower corner of the tank.
The holes were at the spot where the tank sat heavily on the wooden supports beneath it.
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Last edited by CajunSpike; 04-02-2018 at 04:47 PM.
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  #35   IP: 70.186.108.69
Old 10-12-2018, 02:52 AM
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Just to close out my info in this thread....

Bottom corner of original tank. Was multiple holes and bad metal.


Replacement Moeller tank sitting in hand built wood cradle screwed down to original wood tank supports glassed into hull. All lines and fuel gauge hooked up.

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