Return to the home page...

Go Back   Moyer Marine Atomic 4 Community - Home of the Afourians > Introductions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1   IP: 24.108.124.37
Old 10-30-2022, 07:07 PM
Captain Kirk Captain Kirk is offline
Frequent Contributor
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Duncan, BC
Posts: 5
Thanks: 7
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Acid Flushing Fresh Water System?

My first post, please bare with me. I am a new owner of a Cal 34 with a late model atomic 4 with fresh water cooling.
My engine has been seriously overheating. The last time out it registered 250 degrees before I shut it down. The previous owner (61 engine hours ago) spent $8000 Canadian on dealing with the engine overheating problem; boiled and flushed the heat exchanger with acid dip to remove deposits, replaced the manifold and block off gaskets and replaced the exhaust tower to name a few repairs.
There is lots of raw water coming out of the exhaust pipe at the stern with no apparent steam. The last time I looked ( about 10 engine hours ago) the fresh water impeller on the Oberdorfer looked fine. The last time I was down at the boat I took off the exit hose for the Oberdorfer and ran the motor for a few turns and the antifreeze flowed quite freely. I then spend a couple of hours removing the thermostat housing (itís a V-drive with the thermostat at the stern end). It turns out that the thermostat is a 3 spring Holly single action which doesnít move until it reaches 180 degrees (tested at home). It looks like the housing was designed for a double action thermostat which when fully opened with shut of the intake at the top of the housing so I guess Iím going to have to replace the Holly with either the Moyer double action one or go with the Indigo system. The housing itself was full of gunk and from what I can see in the hole beneath it, there is a lot of gunk in the cooling jacket, if that is what it is called under the the thermostat housing. Iím surprised it looks like this after all the work that was done 61 hours ago?
Iíve read Donís description for flushing the raw water system in the MM1 manual and all sounds good, but it doesnít say anything about how to clean out a fresh water system. I am thinking of putting my intake hose from the heat exchanger in a 5 gallon bucket of diluted muriatic acid (after shutting off my bypass hose valve to the thermostat and re-attaching the thermostat housing) and attaching another hose to the the exhaust manifold exit port into another bucket to capture the diluted acid when it comes out.
I havenít taken off the side jacket to see if the diverter valve is clogged. It looks like I would have to take off the distributor with itís brand new Indigo electronic ignition in place to get at the forward bolt. I really donít want to have to do that if I can hep it. Any suggestions before I go any further are welcome.
Attached Images
 
Reply With Quote
  #2   IP: 162.245.50.171
Old 10-31-2022, 10:58 AM
Dave Neptune Dave Neptune is online now
Afourian MVP, Professor Emeritus
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Grove, Oklahoma
Posts: 4,718
Thanks: 626
Thanked 957 Times in 646 Posts
First yes you should have the double action t-stat for the "system" to work properly. I'd first try going without the t-stat and adjust the temp via "flow" with the bypass hose and a valve or clamp. I ran for 35 years without the t-stat and no problems.

It also looks to me as if you have oil gooping up the coolant passages and the goo coating does not allow for good heat transfer from the block and passages.

Dave Neptune
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Dave Neptune For This Useful Post:
Captain Kirk (10-31-2022)
  #3   IP: 69.250.111.245
Old 10-31-2022, 01:24 PM
sastanley's Avatar
sastanley sastanley is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Solomons, MD
Posts: 6,939
Thanks: 1,021
Thanked 546 Times in 407 Posts
I am with Dave...Try running with NO t-stat and see if it still gets hot??
__________________
-Shawn
"Twice Around" - '77 Catalina 30, #511 with original A-4 & MMI manifold - for sale - PM me if interested
"Holiday" - '89 Alura 35 #109 (uh oh, two boat owner!!)
http://www.moyermarine.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic3231_6.gif
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to sastanley For This Useful Post:
Captain Kirk (10-31-2022)
  #4   IP: 24.108.124.37
Old 10-31-2022, 03:00 PM
Captain Kirk Captain Kirk is offline
Frequent Contributor
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Duncan, BC
Posts: 5
Thanks: 7
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Neptune View Post
First yes you should have the double action t-stat for the "system" to work properly. I'd first try going without the t-stat and adjust the temp via "flow" with the bypass hose and a valve or clamp. I ran for 35 years without the t-stat and no problems.

It also looks to me as if you have oil gooping up the coolant passages and the goo coating does not allow for good heat transfer from the block and passages.

Dave Neptune
Thanks Dave, I was thinking the same with the double action thermostat. Yes, the goop causing poor transfer of cooling makes sense. I hadn't considered that it could be oil in there. The 2 liter bottle of coolant that I extracted after the overheating occurrence doesn't appear to have any oil in it. I was actually thinking of filtering it and putting it back in the system once I get the coolant passages clean. There is a bypass valve already there which I should be able to control the temperature with. Being a V-drive, it's at the back of the motor so that if I want to adjust it after the initial warm-up I have to take the steps out in front of the motor and reach inside to get at it, way too much hassle, especially when I'm single handling. The double action thermostat should take care of that by itself.

Last edited by Captain Kirk; 10-31-2022 at 03:06 PM. Reason: Wanted to add something...
Reply With Quote
  #5   IP: 24.108.124.37
Old 10-31-2022, 03:09 PM
Captain Kirk Captain Kirk is offline
Frequent Contributor
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Duncan, BC
Posts: 5
Thanks: 7
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by sastanley View Post
I am with Dave...Try running with NO t-stat and see if it still gets hot??
Thanks, I will especially when running 'cleaner' through the system.
Reply With Quote
  #6   IP: 64.246.99.67
Old 10-31-2022, 04:21 PM
zellerj zellerj is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 287
Thanks: 5
Thanked 97 Times in 60 Posts
My engine overheated for 20 years, usually running about 210 F. My flow out the back was good too. I finally solved it by taking off the alternator, distributer, and the side plate, revealing a bunch of junk crusted onto the cylinder walls. After picking out this junk as best I could, upon reinstalling everything, the engine ran at 140 F. Mark the direction the rotor is pointing so the distributer goes back in the same way it came out.

I know your boat has a heat exchanger and antifreeze in the engine, but perhaps it was raw water cooled for a number of years and junk accumulated around the cylinder walls and it was never removed.

IF you go this route be very careful not to break the bolts attaching the side plate, but if you do, fixes are available. I broke two of mine while doing this.
__________________
Jim Zeller
1982 Catalina 30
Kelleys Island, Ohio

Last edited by zellerj; 10-31-2022 at 04:23 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to zellerj For This Useful Post:
Captain Kirk (10-31-2022), sastanley (11-02-2022)
  #7   IP: 24.108.124.37
Old 10-31-2022, 04:30 PM
Captain Kirk Captain Kirk is offline
Frequent Contributor
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Duncan, BC
Posts: 5
Thanks: 7
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by sastanley View Post
I am with Dave...Try running with NO t-stat and see if it still gets hot??
Quote:
Originally Posted by zellerj View Post
My engine overheated for 20 years, usually running about 210 F. My flow out the back was good too. I finally solved it by taking off the alternator, distributer, and the side plate, revealing a bunch of junk crusted onto the cylinder walls. After picking out this junk as best I could, upon reinstalling everything, the engine ran at 140 F. Mark the direction the rotor is pointing so the distributer goes back in the same way it came out.

I know your boat has a heat exchanger and antifreeze in the engine, but perhaps it was raw water cooled for a number of years and junk accumulated around the cylinder walls and it was never removed.

IF you go this route be very careful not to break the bolts attaching the side plate, but if you do, fixes are available. I broke two of mine while doing this.
Thanks a lot Jim. Thats certainly a spot I've been considering and avoided because of having to take the distributor off and of course the possibility of breaking the bolts on the side plate. It sounds like you didn't do a flush? and you were able to clear enough 'junk' to get the motor cooling properly. Good point about making sure the rotor is pointing the right direction in the distributor if I end up taking your route. I still want to try a flush first...Thanks again, Kirk
Reply With Quote
  #8   IP: 64.246.99.67
Old 10-31-2022, 04:48 PM
zellerj zellerj is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 287
Thanks: 5
Thanked 97 Times in 60 Posts
I don't know your system, however just to caution you about the acid flush and recirculating the acid through your system. If you run the engine during this procedure, the exhaust will not be cooled by the water, and the hot exhaust can easily melt plastic water lift mufflers and rubber exhaust hoses.
__________________
Jim Zeller
1982 Catalina 30
Kelleys Island, Ohio
Reply With Quote
  #9   IP: 24.108.124.37
Old 11-02-2022, 01:41 AM
Captain Kirk Captain Kirk is offline
Frequent Contributor
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Duncan, BC
Posts: 5
Thanks: 7
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by zellerj View Post
I don't know your system, however just to caution you about the acid flush and recirculating the acid through your system. If you run the engine during this procedure, the exhaust will not be cooled by the water, and the hot exhaust can easily melt plastic water lift mufflers and rubber exhaust hoses.
Thanks Jim, I will just be running the acid through the anti freeze system by using an external pump hooked up to the exit hose from the Oberdorfer fresh water pump and out the exit port on the exhaust manifold which will dump back into the diluted acid bucket where it can be picked up again by the external pump and recirculated. I will block off the crossover valve as well to make sure fluid can get through the diverter valve on the side of the manifold. (here's hoping that's clear!) After a few cycles I'll run fresh water through from the dock hose to clean out the remaining guck. This way I won't be starting the motor at all. Still organizing hoses etc today. I may actually get everything hooked up tomorrow. In the meantime I've been cutting out the old hoses and fighting the new ones onto the nipples. I've also got the thermostat out and re-connected the housing. I'll either be buying double acting thermostat with the hope that my housing is ok or going with the indigo electronics external one, haven't got there yet.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
fresh water cooling., overheating, thermostat

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Procedure for acid flushing and pressure flushing Don Moyer General Maintenance 55 06-14-2022 08:55 PM
New Moyer Fresh Water Cooling System Kit for A4 - never used jblumhorst For Sale - Engines and Engine Parts 1 06-05-2017 06:33 PM
fresh water flush eric 352 General Interest 3 01-24-2005 09:06 PM
Engine running "fine" until it stopped suddenly within a few revolutions. sundowner Troubleshooting 7 12-18-2004 10:37 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:31 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.


Universalģ is a registered trademark of Westerbeke Corporation

Copyright © 2004-2022 Moyer Marine Inc.

All Rights Reserved