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Old 05-25-2020, 06:42 PM
Warrencasey Warrencasey is offline
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Not starting after water in oil issue!

Our A4 is not starting. This is the story:

It started with the engine dying a few months ago on the way to the starting line for a race. When we got back to the slip and checked it out, we found that we had seawater in the oil. The grey goo had foamed up and spilled out of the crankcase breather into the spark arrestor and then into the carburetor, which killed the motor.

A couple of days later, we tried to remove the grey goo (water and oil mixture). It was too thick for our oil change pump. With research on the Moyer Marine community forum, we figured out how to thin the nasty grey goo and were successful at removing it, after which we replaced the oil twice. We also found out the most likely water access to the crankcase was the seawater pump. We removed the pump and sure enough the weep holes were blocked. We ordered a new pump. We also tested the compression, which was good.

After we installed the seawater pump, we tried to start the engine – we got it going but just barely. We couldn’t get the engine to throttle up – the carburetor must be full of the grey goo. We removed the carburetor. We had a new carburetor (we had a second) and attached it, but couldn’t get the engine to turn over anymore. We also discovered an exhaust leak, which we removed and rebuilt the exhaust system. We also destroyed the starter trying to start the engine – it was a very old starter. We bought a new one from Moyer. We also decided to rebuild both of our carburetors.

We were very excited to attach our new rebuilt carburetors (we tried both) and tried to start the engine. We had a new seawater pump, starter, spark plugs, exhaust and carb, but It still will not start! We had good spark at each cylinder – everything was correct, but no go! So, we checked the compression again – bingo! No compression in cylinder 2, 3, or 4 – Ok in 1. We are now thinking the valves are stuck open in those three cylinders! With all the seawater and goo in the system, we think they may have gotten stuck between all the time it took to buy the parts, rebuild the carburetors, and the COVID-19 mess. It’s been a three plus month ordeal.

The engine was rebuilt with Moyer's help and parts about 11 years ago by us and has run fantastic all this time.

Our question is: What do we do now?
1. Should we first remove the valve cover and then the head to see if we can get the valves un-stuck?

2. Will using penetrating oil or MMO loosen the valves?

3. Can we unstick the valves from behind the valve cover or is it better from the top under the head?

4. Or is there another problem we can't think of?
Thank you,

Sincerely,
Warren Casey and Ed Burnett

Last edited by Warrencasey; 05-26-2020 at 12:37 AM.
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Old 05-26-2020, 10:26 AM
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Hey Warren & Ed-
Before doing item number one I would suggest trying to loosen the stuck valves.

Squirt some MMO into the spark plug holes.
Then try to free the stuck valves by inserting a bent screwdriver or “L” shaped allen wrench in through the spark plug hole and pressing on top of the valve.
You might need to repeat the MMO soak for a day or two.

If you’re unable to free the valves, you’ll then have to remove the head.


Here are a couple of threads I quick searched about stuck valves...
http://www.moyermarineforum.com/foru...t=stuck+valves
http://www.moyermarineforum.com/foru...t=stuck+valves
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Last edited by roadnsky; 05-26-2020 at 10:30 AM.
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Warrencasey (06-07-2020)
  #3   IP: 165.225.38.121
Old 05-26-2020, 11:00 AM
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Have you opened your valve cover while cleaning the goo?
If not, and depending on how bad is you access to the valve cover, I would open it: you may have a much of it all around the springs, the bottom drains of the "valve compartment" may be plugged too now.

Once open, you may be able to "wiggle" the valves a little, which will help MMO gets into the guides, and help free the valves.


Worst case (after trying the MMO as mentioned before), try to spray some carb cleaner into your spark plugs holes, trying to aim at the valves seat (with the small red pipe bent the right direction). BUT if you do that, make sure to spray generously MMO after, before turning the engine.

All this is well worth trying before pulling the head...
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Old 05-27-2020, 12:53 PM
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Thanks for the ideas - Ed has put about a tablespoon of MMO in the cylinders and turned the engine over a few times, both by hand and by starter. He will let it soak for a few days. I will let you know how it goes!
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Old 05-27-2020, 01:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrencasey View Post
Thanks for the ideas - Ed has put about a tablespoon of MMO in the cylinders and turned the engine over a few times, both by hand and by starter. He will let it soak for a few days. I will let you know how it goes!
key is to spray in the right location, and have as much possible soak the valves not so much the cylinders. Good luck
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  #6   IP: 75.27.254.152
Old 06-02-2020, 01:54 AM
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We decided to open the valve cover - we found 7 of the valve lifters stuck and one of the valves. With much MMO and elbow grease Ed got them all to drop and the one stuck valve to loosen! We turned the engine over and could see all the valves and lifters moving again! We are now waiting on a new gasket, coming this week to start the engine for real! We are truly hoping it will run again! Ed went down yesterday and check on his work again and everything was still working!
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Old 06-02-2020, 07:57 AM
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Great work, given the access!

If you want to be 100% sure while you wait for your gasket, you can take cylinders compression. That should not spill much oil with a plate installed without gasket, and will give you confirmation that you are all set with your valves.

You may want to do that with the cheapest oil you can find, as you will through that oil away after the first half hour or so of running the engine.

Make sure to close the intake water valve, if once through cooling.
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Old 06-06-2020, 12:10 AM
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We got her running today! It sounds great! Thanks for all the help!
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Old 06-06-2020, 04:27 AM
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Thumbs up

Hey, Is this the Warren Casey that was here back in '09?

Long time no see.

R
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Old 06-07-2020, 04:31 PM
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Yes, it is the same Warren Casey! The engine had been running fantastic for eleven years until this mishap. So I didn't get on the forum much! I will get a video of her running soon as I get back up to Ventura next week!

How is your engine running?
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Old 06-07-2020, 06:46 PM
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  #11   IP: 75.27.254.152
Old 06-10-2020, 12:49 PM
Warrencasey Warrencasey is offline
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The motor is purring and is ready for another 11 years with out a problem! We reattached the cabinetry yesterday after this video! We are almost ready for sea trials. Hopefully we will be sailing in a few weeks! Thanks again to everyone that helped with fixes - they work very well!
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Old 06-11-2020, 01:29 AM
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My boat has been on the hard for a few years getting all the rig and rot fixed.
Also electrics and water system and upholstery.... all fixed. This was supposed to be the retirement summer when I got to finish up and do some boating. big fat pandemic happened. Can't complain though. We are healthy so far.


I see your engine beds worked out fine.

Russ
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