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  #26   IP: 72.28.255.171
Old 03-02-2011, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
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How much??
Starts at $499.
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Old 03-02-2011, 09:02 PM
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Please forgive this old skool guy, but $100 more than what?

edit:
Thanks Tom, you were quicker on the draw than me.
$500 is a major step toward fresh water cooling if y'all get my drift.
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Old 03-02-2011, 09:11 PM
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Neil, See my modified post...i am being a smart-a$$, but that is my pessimistic view of the world.

By the way - I agree with you 100%...I have a handheld GPS and a USB GPS puck for my laptop already..I'd much rather buy the HX from Moyer and get my FWC going than have an iPad on board.
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Old 03-02-2011, 10:19 PM
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You could also buy a nice sextant and a Nautical Almanac at that price as well.

Here's my iPad story:

I have a Mac Mini (from which I am typing this note) that I bought when my PC crashed for the 17,000th time. The Mini has performed flawlessly for several years. My bride has a MacBook Pro that has performed flawlessly and my daughter has my wife's old 5-year-old MacBook that has a newly installed hard drive and it performs flawlessly. I like Apple products. They work. When the iPad came out last year, I really wasn't interested in them. I thought they were an over-priced, glorified iPhone that you couldn't talk on... too small to be a laptop and too big to carry around like a phone. Sort of a niche in no-man's-land. Then, in an unexpected surprise, I received one as a gift from my in-laws. I have been hooked since that fateful June day.

Are iPad's expensive? Yes. Most quality things are: like tinned marine primary wire, WEST System epoxy, and the Tartan Standpipe I purchased on this very website. For me, it comes down to value. Would I buy an iPad just to use on my boat? Probably not... not yet anyway. But I use my iPad for everything from checking weather at work, to finding an Emergency Room in the Florida Keys last week (don't ask), to rearranging my schedule, to email, to reading books, to watching movies, to just chillin' with a little Robert Earl Keen on the ipod function of the iPad. My Navionics chartplotter software on my iPad is even more robust than my equally priced Standard Horizon CP180i and my C-MAP data card.

Are iPads for everybody? Certainly not and the reasons are as varied as there are reasons. Money. New-fangled technology. Apple's prima donna attitude. Whatever the reason, some people will not or do not like them, just like I don't like professional basketball or gamble in casinos. Individuality is wonderful thing and we can learn from each other. I will say that my opinion is the iPad is cutting edge and that within a few years they will be as commonplace on boats as the ipod is today. And we'll all wonder why it took so long.
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Old 03-03-2011, 06:02 AM
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Wait no more...
Well, there's still the final verdict. I like to keep an eye on the forums before jumping into a new device. iPad looks very useful for my lifestyle, but ... there are always buts. Waiting to see what our local carrier will do with it too.
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Old 03-03-2011, 06:25 AM
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I just purchased the ipad1 for my wife’s birthday. She didn’t want it, so I go it. She already has an iphone. I had been wanting my own lab top for myself for a while. So far I like the ipad. I have loaded movies, songs, and pictures on it. I am not really a cell phone person. I do wish it had a camera. I just loaded the Navonics software on it. Trying that out now.
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Old 03-03-2011, 09:26 AM
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Believing that a picture is worth a thousand words, here are just a few screen shots of my iPad running Navionics. The first is Kent Narrows here on the Chesapeake Bay, near my slip. All the little icons, like the purple sailboats, buoys, wrenches, bridges, etc, can be touched with your finger. When that happens, another window opens up giving great detail about the object.



For example, if I touch the blue diamond with the "C" in it, I get the current going through the Narrows (quite thrillling at times!) and the forecast out to forever. If you touch the purple sailboat, all the associated marina info pops up (fuel, berthing, phone numbers, etc). Touching a navaid reveals all the pertinent data there (R FL R 4S BELL Red Lateral Buoy (nun, i.e. conical shape) ""92"" having red flashing light with a period of 4 seconds and a bell as fog signal.) The red diamond with a "T" gives you all the tide data. The list goes on and on.



And for all my celestial navigators:


"I'd rather light a candle, than to curse your darkness" - Gale Snoats "Raising Arizona"
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Old 03-03-2011, 10:34 AM
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Have not been thru there in a while. Is Annie's still there?
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Old 03-03-2011, 10:45 AM
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Have not been thru there in a while. Is Annie's still there?
Oh yeah, Annie's is doing quite well. Harris' Crab House is doing well too. I'm just glad I work weekends so as not to hassle with the Knuckle-headed weekend warriors at Red Eyes Dock Bar. Those clowns give buffoons a bad name.
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Old 03-03-2011, 11:34 AM
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Red face Way, Way, way Off-Topic! (But Bill started it!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by rigspelt View Post
...iPad looks very useful for my lifestyle, but ...
Well, this sorta sums up what Tom was sayin'...

I'm currently stuck in a cold, dark ballroom working AT a MICROSOFT meeting.
Yesterday in the Keynote, two of the presenters spent the better part of their presentation discussing how "cool" (their word) the new version of iPAD is.
They were especially impressed with the genius of the "Smart Cover" for it.
One of them (a product developer) actually said, "We need to start thinking like Apple does!"
I could say a lot more but would be going against the Non-Disclosure that I signed.
(The funniest part is almost everything we do backstage to support their meeting is MAC based. Including how we're interfacing their PC's to the screens.)

Not selling anything. Just sayin'...
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Old 03-03-2011, 12:02 PM
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Data, data, everywhere not a bit to think.

Tom,
What the application you have?

I bought Polarnavy for the old Mac. A good simple system for $35.00
It has GRIB data display. so I can make my own real observations about the bouy data. I don't know if they will make it for the iOS, but it will display NMEA data if it hooked up to a nav server on a boat. Imagine all those instruments right in my lap. I bought a used system last year and it has a little black box for the backbone of all of the different transponders(knots, temp, wind, compass, blah blah. I guess there's a way to link that to my old laptop ala usb.
So, wouldn't it be great to put a bluetooth dongle on the output of the Nav server(black box) and use an ipad for the display. I could put the ipad in an clear box and laugh at the rain.

Sometimes I wish I were a computer programer so I could just make all the things on my wish list. Oh well, at least can fix engines.

Ta,
Russ
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Old 03-03-2011, 12:21 PM
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Oh,
Polarnavy is at :
http://www.polarnavy.com/index.php
For Windows and linux too

All this wishing of mine could be done on PCs too. I'm not branded, I just don't know how to fix computers, I just drive them. In fact the Mac iOS(ipad sys.) does not support OBDII-bluetooth apps. There are lots of Android apps for this.
So I have to use my old Mac powerbook to link to the bluetooth dongle that I have in my car's diagnostics data terminal. I actually fixed the check engine light the other day with just one finger!

Jerry give my ideas to the lab and send me a free test module.


Rus
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Old 03-03-2011, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
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Jerry give my ideas to the lab and send me a free test module.
Ohhhh, we're ALWAYS trying to give these guyz wish lists!
Trust me...
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Old 03-03-2011, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
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Tom,
What the application you have?

I bought Polarnavy for the old Mac. A good simple system for $35.00
It has GRIB data display. so I can make my own real observations about the bouy data. I don't know if they will make it for the iOS, but it will display NMEA data if it hooked up to a nav server on a boat. Imagine all those instruments right in my lap. I bought a used system last year and it has a little black box for the backbone of all of the different transponders(knots, temp, wind, compass, blah blah. I guess there's a way to link that to my old laptop ala usb.
So, wouldn't it be great to put a bluetooth dongle on the output of the Nav server(black box) and use an ipad for the display. I could put the ipad in an clear box and laugh at the rain.

Sometimes I wish I were a computer programer so I could just make all the things on my wish list. Oh well, at least can fix engines.

Ta,
Russ
Russ,

Another confession: I am not especially tech saavy. That's probably why I like Apple stuff so much - they've done all the thinking for me. It's also why a lot of folks don't care for Apple. I am simply using off-the-shelf apps for the iPad. Nothing cosmic. No getting NMEA 0183 to translate to SeaTalk or any of that higher level operation. I'm simply using the Navionics East Coast HD software running on a completely stock iPad 3G/WiFi. When I bought the Navionics app, it was selling for $9.99. I kid you not. This software is more robust and easier to use than my dedicated Standard Horizon Chartplotter. At a fraction of the cost. I think Navionics has raised the price to $30, but it's still a steal if you already have the iPad.

Now what is truly interesting is a link that Moderator Bill posted about Chetco Digital Instruments and their foray into not only navigation, but digital engine instrumentation via a dedicated WiFi hub using HTTP rather than NMEA 2000 or 0183. This allows the user to read a tremendous amount of data by simply opening a web brouser on any WiFi capable device (phone, laptop, iPad, etc). The possibilites are eye-watering. Here is a link to that article: http://www.panbo.com/archives/2011/0...rnet.html#more
I think this is kinda wher you're coming from with the bluetooth link. This chetco deal seems to take some of the mystery out of it and the potential appears extraordinary. Of course, the same was said for Betamax!

BTW, I just noticed you were from Fairbanks. Where do you keep your boat? I was extremely lucky to have lived on Kodiak Island from '97 to 2000 when I was flying for the Coast Guard. Do you keep her on Cook Inlet towards Anchorage or maybe down toward Seward? Days are getting longer up there! I know you are happy about that.
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Old 03-03-2011, 02:58 PM
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This caveat is not borne of personal experience but IMHO still bears some merit:

Saltwater and electrics boyz, saltwater and electrics.

Be prepared, have a backup ready.
Contrary to this policy is the following story:

I was on a dive vacation in Hawaii in the 80's when dive computers were first emerging into the marketplace. All instrumentation to that point was mechanical for reliability, after all we were talking life support systems and the charter operators were extremely safety conscious due to liability exposure.

A vacationing dive instructor was on board showing off his new dive computer that tracked his dive profile history and did all the repetitive dive calculations using a different algorithm (Haldane I think) rather than the tried and true U.S. Navy dive tables.

The charter operation divemaster asked why not just send the computer on the dive and stay on the boat himself? He could read about it when the computer returned!

That was the 80's. It's interesting to note I dove with the same charter 5 years ago and they now require dive computers. You don't have one, you can rent one from them but nobody leaves the boat without a computer.
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Old 03-03-2011, 03:14 PM
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Ok tom,
I think we hijacked this thread for a bit, but it is now back to engine instrumentation anyway.
I learned wifi apps will work for the iphone/ipod/ipad. there are some out there.
of course at 600 bucks for the thingy, I might buy some new rigging first.
I do have no less than four separate displays that came with the nexus system I bought.
I am really just blowing smoke here, but I like to learn what's possible.

The boat is in Homer. I'm sure you probably did approaches to the airport there. I see the Coast Guard doing touch-n-gos all the time.
Two C.G. ships, the Sedge and the Roanoke Island were stationed there back then. A new one, the Hickory was built and replaced the Sedge a few years ago. The Roanoke I. sits sentinel over two of the scruffiest leaky tugs in the world. I think those boats need to get made into artificial reefs. A couple of TV stars over there too. You know, those loud crabbers.

Days are getting much longer now

R.
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Old 03-18-2011, 04:27 AM
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interesting conversation
i've been playing with some gadgets and here's some of what i found

spent last year with a laptop on board trying out some things to see what the reality of leaving for a summer and still being able to work as needed.
loaded a dry cell backup battery for medical equipment on board strictly for use with the laptop. could run it several hours every day for about a week before it needed a charge.

all work related programs installed
and a wireless card (sprint no longer supports using blackberry as a modem)
all data files in my office are backed up to a web based data file storage system. i can access them anywhere an internet connection exists.

working is a problem while anchored out. looking at a screen on a rocking boat for any length of time effects me.

downloaded several free nav software programs and free charts from NOAA - and plugged in a $50 garmin gps puck. this is the ticket. works brilliantly.

the chart plotter is great with one exception - it has to stay down below.
and the anchor alarm lets me sleep well

so while the working part is still a problem (heck i go sailing to get away from it!) for what i need the laptop still gives the most flexibility and with the current price of a netbook its a pretty good deal.

oh yeah - and streaming music from Pandora on blackberry or the laptop- through the boats stereo got all the cd's off the boat. really great when hanging out at the end of the day with a crisp bottle of wine and some food on the grille.

so yes it works if you want to work
all said and done, i just want to go sailing.
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Old 03-18-2011, 05:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomG View Post
Believing that a picture is worth a thousand words, here are just a few screen shots of my iPad running Navionics.
For me, the iPad is about serving up information, and Tom's post neatly demonstrates why I have decided to get one. This thread actually is very on-topic, because the iPad (for some of us) fits a handy niche working with our boats as well as living on them. It's lighter than my laptop, so I will have it with me doing maintenance, on day sails and in the cockpit, cabin or engine space as needed. It's bigger than my smartphone, so it is more useful for serving up information.

Some uses:

1. Maintenance on the boat: photographing parts, making and using lists, displaying reference notes, images and PDFs, email to order parts.
2. Under way: GPS and electronic charts (supplement to stationary chartplotter, which is out at the helm), email, second cellphone, reference material.
3. Lifestyle: basic photographs, storing images off my camera, music.

I was an "early adopter" when PCs came out, and like Tom I've struggled with Windows systems for a long time. Now the family is old enough that I find myself administering a home network, and MS has just orphaned Windows Home Server. We're shifting to Apple for the integration and simplicity. It took a while for Apple to develop to the point where I could be comfortable with that decision, and I hope they maintain their focus for many years to come.
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Old 03-25-2011, 01:03 PM
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I picked up the ipad2. Also purchased navonics hd. I like both so far. Does anyone know if the ipad2 requires one to have their 3GS enabled for it to work while on the boat. I thought I read somewhere that the ipad2 had an internal gps, in addition to the cell tower triangulation. It would be nice not to have to burn 3GS minutes while navigating. Take care, Russ
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Old 03-25-2011, 03:29 PM
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iPads GPS, but only in the 3G version. The Wi-Fi-only versions don't have GPS. This is true of the iPad 1 and the iPad 2.

http://gps.about.com/b/2011/03/20/ap...pabilities.htm
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Old 03-25-2011, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
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I picked up the ipad2. Also purchased navonics hd. I like both so far. Does anyone know if the ipad2 requires one to have their 3GS enabled for it to work while on the boat. I thought I read somewhere that the ipad2 had an internal gps, in addition to the cell tower triangulation. It would be nice not to have to burn 3GS minutes while navigating. Take care, Russ
Up until a few days ago I thought my wife's Ipad was not equiped with GPS. We thought it was doing some fancy triangulating with the cell towers to give location.
My daughter was practicing to be car navigator for an upcomming road trip and they loaded some map application. Her mom says she shrieked and said" it's moving!" refering to the dot on the map. Thats when we took the time to read the instructions. At the time the 3g service was not current, so we realized it does have a GPS. As for the 3g service, we just pay once in a while when someone(wife) goes traveling and likes to have that convenience. I think it is a flat rate-around ten bucks—not sure about that.
We only have three roads in Alaska, so we never needed a GPs for the car.
They will got to Michigan, New York and parts in between next month. It should be a real asset on a road trip.

Ipad good. Ipad keep bored teenager happy. Mom happy. Much peace in car.
Dad stay home and drink beer.

Russ
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Old 03-25-2011, 08:38 PM
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I got my iPad 3G last June, and I use it daily. It's with me at work (I'm a teacher), at home, and on my C & C 27 here in BC.

As for navigation, there are two flavours of iPads. Only the iPad 3G has its own internal GPS antenna. The WiFi-only flavour does not have a GPS antenna, though for $100 you can purchase an external one that plays nicely with the iPad. On my iPad 3G, the internal GPS antenna is big and gives pinpoint fixes rapidly. The battery lasts for 10 hours on a single charge, and is quick to recharge, which on my boat is a priority. I use iNavX as my navigation software of choice, and love it (I have no connection to that company in any way other than as a happy customer). I still have all my paper charts, and I am meticulous with my log book (paper based for now). I have an older GPS unit as a backup, plus my iPhone with the Navionics app, but mostly I rely on my coastal piloting skills I've been using for 30 years. But as a chartplotter, the iPad is a great deal!

I've also been scanning in my operator's manuals (as PDFs) and have them on the iPad. With kids on board, watching a video now and again is also easy and fun. I've read more books in the last year than I've read in the last five, simply because it's convenient, and lightweight. With a 3G no-contract data plan for the iPad I can browse the web (not important for my parents, for example; it would never occur to them to do so, but my wife and kids and I do like to stay connected with Grandparents via pictures from our anchorage on Facebook, etc.), plus it allows you to browse forums such as this wonderful one when you're staring at the bottom of the shallow barrel that is your own personal knowledge base

Cost-wise, I don't think you can beat it. I'd love to have a big bright chartplotter that I can read from my sailboat's cockpit, but how many boat dollars for a 10" or 11" display? Compare that to $500 -700 for the iPad, $50 for the software, and widely available electronic charts. Although I don't use it, my software can act as a repeater for NMEA data, including MacENC on a Mac laptop over WiFi, external GPS antennas, AIS receivers, wind/depth instruments, etc. iNavX is rich in features, but easy to use, and is updated regularly (for free). There is no doubt about it, it is a very economical colour chartplotter. And, the iPad is big (over 9.5" diagonally) so you can see lots of the chart in one glance. You can pinch to scroll out (and iNavX refreshes the chart instantly), or stretch two fingers to zoom in. You don't get "lost" as you do on little displays where you see the detail you need but don't know what part of the chart you're viewing.

Downsides? The iPad is not waterproof. There is glare in bright sunlight. It is not a permanent installation.

I've actually ordered a waterproof case from DryCase (http://store.drycase.com/Waterproof-...et-p/dc-17.htm), because my cockpit is obviously open to the weather. In an enclosed bridge, being not permanently installed is actually an advantage... take it to the main salon to do research or online browsing, read a book or watch a movie in your cabin, or take it to the helm for navigation.

The upside? The iPad just works. Always. I'm not affiliated with Apple in any way, but it seems so much better than most laptops or desktop computers. It fires up in 1 second, is silent, doesn't give off heat, has a gorgeous display, and is as close to problem-free as any thing this side of a wooden stick. How could you not like a device where you solve a glitch by pressing the Home button? End of problem. No more fiddling with "why isn't this #?!##! thing WORKING?!?". Turn it on. It works.

The new iPad 2 is even thinner and lighter than the original (which, for a handheld device is surprisingly important), and it is even faster.

For others' opinions here are two people that I respect: the first is actually writing about 2 external GPS antennas that play nicely with the WiFi-only iPad (which does not have GPS), but he brings a good perspective to bear: http://goo.gl/tDi6d lots of good comments from users following his article... and for an alternative point of view, (ie: sort of against the iPad) http://www.madmariner.com/equipment/...TING_070610_EE
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Old 03-27-2011, 08:11 AM
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Celestial navigators and star-gazers will want to see the amazing sky chart apps for iPad and iPhone: move with you as you turn to look at the night sky.

The iPad marine chart packages are amazing -- even covers Canada. Navionics' echarts for iPad are far cheaper than the marine echarts we've been used to.
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Last edited by rigspelt; 03-27-2011 at 08:18 AM.
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  #49   IP: 72.28.255.171
Old 03-27-2011, 08:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rigspelt View Post
Navionics' echarts for iPad are far cheaper than the marine echarts we've been used to.
And much, much easier to use.
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  #50   IP: 166.102.89.194
Old 04-08-2011, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
Over the past few weeks, TomG and I have swapped a couple of postings (and then a couple of PM’s) on the subject of how the Apple iPad might be used on the water. Obviously, this is pushing the envelope regarding “off-topic” discussion. Nevertheless, it frustrates me a bit at times that we deliberately limit the discussion matter when we have this wonderful collection of forum members whose experience, education, intuition, judgment, etc. challenge and entertain me every day. The intentions are honorable, but I’d like to try something that might interest like-minded individuals, without distracting or flat-out aggravating those members who appreciate the clarity of “mission” in the forum.

Our forum software has the ability to establish what it calls “public groups” – discussion categories which a member may join and view/post if desired, but will otherwise not be visible. I’d like to give it a try, and TomG has agreed to join me in the first iteration – a group dedicated to the iPad discussion we dabbled with earlier.

To join us (or simply to see how the whole thing works), click on the “User CP” option on the main navigation menu. Then select the “Group Memberships” option on the left side, which will display a list of user groups you are free to join. From there, it’s a matter of a couple of clicks.
Joining the “iPad User Group” will make visible a new discussion category, called “iPad Applications on the Water,” which will appear in the Off-Topic group towards the bottom of the page. Join the group and you’ll see this. Choose not to join, and you won’t.

Feedback regarding the idea (not simply this first rather specific iteration) would be appreciated. If you’d like to suggest another subject for a different group, please reply here or drop me a PM. I don’t really have a sense of where we’d draw the line as to what’s ok and what isn’t, beyond the broad requirements of decorum and taste. We’ll take ‘em as they come.

Bill
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I agree having a tablet on the water would be a huge advantage but also have an problem with Apples restrictive way of doing business. The windows operating system is too clunky. My company has gone to an OEM to have one built for us based on the android operating system 3.0. Our first hard copy is due next week and is speced to blow all the others "out of the water" Pun intended. George
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