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  #126   IP: 100.40.58.241
Old 05-02-2020, 10:25 AM
jcwright jcwright is offline
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Hello Surcouf.

My first attempt was 'head up'. I followed the procedure described in the MM manual, but not closely enough, as I damaged the gasket. My second attempt was 'head down', which I found easier. But, I had an engine stand, and I see you don't.

Jack
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  #127   IP: 108.34.135.205
Old 05-02-2020, 11:16 PM
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So finally.... following step by step Don on YouTube on how to reassemble the flanges, seals, coupling etc... the “final nut” is on. This has been a very disappointing journey: paint is flaking when wrenches are turned, paint is dented when engine is flipped, it seems that I am always short of a bolt, or cannot find the right one (too long? Too short?).

I still need to go get the proper key for the accessory shaft, install water pump, thermostat housing, manifold etc... but having tightened together coupling, oil pan, block, head and flywheel housing is a major step for me. I could have never done it without you guys. Thank you

To come in the next few days: finishing to mount the rest, distributor installation (TDC to be found), organise the test bench, and try to fire that thing!

Note: I hope there is no penalty for poor paint jobs.... I have new heightened considerations for car body shops and whoever can achieve an OK paint job on an engine...
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A nostalgic PO - Previously "Almost There" - Catalina 27 (1979)

Last edited by Surcouf; 05-05-2020 at 09:01 AM. Reason: spelling
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Old 05-03-2020, 01:20 AM
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Dude! ... you are "Almost there".

... Sorry... I could not resist.
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Last edited by ronstory; 05-06-2020 at 02:30 PM. Reason: grammar
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  #129   IP: 165.225.38.121
Old 05-06-2020, 07:28 AM
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I know... it is a rolling joke!!

Putting everything together is taking forever.... Next time, I will just pull a check and have Ken send me a new block.
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A nostalgic PO - Previously "Almost There" - Catalina 27 (1979)

Last edited by Surcouf; 05-06-2020 at 07:46 AM.
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  #130   IP: 108.185.228.107
Old 05-06-2020, 09:12 AM
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Yes!!! She’s looking great! Nice job!
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  #131   IP: 67.169.215.221
Old 05-06-2020, 02:30 PM
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Yep, that is one nice looking engine.
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  #132   IP: 108.34.135.205
Old 05-06-2020, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronstory View Post
Yep, that is one nice looking engine.
Honestly, I was under the impression that red would go well with bronze. Let’s be honest here, it does not. No wonder why I am not an artist, and work around power plants and other last industrial facilities: beauty is not the priority.
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Old 05-07-2020, 12:59 AM
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I don't know... but the color combo seems to have worked for a few movies.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/KEYCHAIN-Ma...k/371261159795
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Old 05-07-2020, 09:31 AM
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A word of caution

Excellent looking A4. Please avoid the temptation to use the stock
"lifting ring/alternator mount bracket" as a lifting point for re-installing your engine. The leverage factor between the large hole and the two head bolts puts enough force on the head to actually crack it in some cases. I have two heads in my A4 scrap pile that have that "injury". Some of us have actually added a small bracket, attached to that Lift/alt unit, that is supported be a third head bolt, to make it stronger. Others choose to use straps around the entire motor when it's time to do the lift.
Tom
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  #135   IP: 165.225.38.121
Old 05-07-2020, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thatch View Post
Excellent looking A4. Please avoid the temptation to use the stock
"lifting ring/alternator mount bracket" as a lifting point for re-installing your engine. The leverage factor between the large hole and the two head bolts puts enough force on the head to actually crack it in some cases. I have two heads in my A4 scrap pile that have that "injury". Some of us have actually added a small bracket, attached to that Lift/alt unit, that is supported be a third head bolt, to make it stronger. Others choose to use straps around the entire motor when it's time to do the lift.
Tom
Thank you ! good to know. I have used both that hook and straps to lift the engine from the boat. Then straps through the engine mounts holes to go back and forth from the shop.
I will avoid using it, just for fear of cracking the block just when installing it back into the boat... I can just not fathom what my reaction would be, so close to the goal line, after so many hours of work... I would "blow a gasket" on the spot (no pun intended)
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A nostalgic PO - Previously "Almost There" - Catalina 27 (1979)

Last edited by Surcouf; 05-07-2020 at 09:40 AM. Reason: spelling
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  #136   IP: 165.225.38.121
Old 05-07-2020, 09:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronstory View Post
I don't know... but the color combo seems to have worked for a few movies.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/KEYCHAIN-Ma...k/371261159795
LOL... never seen any of those Marvel movies. Let's hope that the engine is as bullet proof as the movie character!
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Old 05-07-2020, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thatch View Post
Excellent looking A4. Please avoid the temptation to use the stock
"lifting ring/alternator mount bracket" as a lifting point for re-installing your engine. The leverage factor between the large hole and the two head bolts puts enough force on the head to actually crack it in some cases. I have two heads in my A4 scrap pile that have that "injury". Some of us have actually added a small bracket, attached to that Lift/alt unit, that is supported be a third head bolt, to make it stronger. Others choose to use straps around the entire motor when it's time to do the lift.
Tom
Personal opinion: +1!!!!

That original lifting eye is a terrible piece of engineering, and using it is just asking for big trouble.

Bill

Last edited by Administrator; 05-07-2020 at 10:05 AM.
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  #138   IP: 108.34.135.205
Old 05-08-2020, 01:36 AM
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So tonight conversion of the eBay distributor from old Points to electronics. I had no real procedure here, and tried to use common sense and logic... we will see if that was a good idea...

Installing the water plate, Finding the TDC with Don M on YouTube, pouring the 5QT of oil (that was a good feeling), connecting the temporary gages (water temp and oil pressure), starter, accessory gear (temporary, I have not been able to find the right key yet), water pump, fuel pump, carburetor (untouched for now; I will mess with that if the engines runs. If it ain’t broken...). Every 10 minutes, a dent in the new paint... stay calm.

Questions:
- the 3 studs For the manifold are not “fully engaged” in the nuts (or reverse?). I am pretty sure I did not mess up with other studs, as these 3 were packed separately by Ken. Is that a big issue?
- for the test, should the engine be flat, or slightly tilted like in the sailboat?

Thank you!!
PS no idea why one picture is reverse...
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  #139   IP: 155.186.124.219
Old 05-08-2020, 09:58 AM
Dave Neptune Dave Neptune is offline
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Testing flat is fine. If you want to mimic the angle it won't hurt and again it is not necessary.

Fair winds. _/) _/)

Dave Neptune
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  #140   IP: 24.152.132.140
Old 05-08-2020, 10:07 AM
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As long as the oil level reads full on the dipstick, neither low or high.
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prior boats 1987 Westsail 32, 1970 Catalina 22
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Old 05-08-2020, 10:13 AM
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Thank you Dave & Neil

Another question for you guys, on top of the previous one:
- what torque should I put on the 2 thermostat housing bolts? the nut thread is backed by a pretty thin wall, and I am concerned that 35lbf is quite a lot.
- the 3 studs For the manifold are not “fully engaged” in the nuts (or reverse?). I am pretty sure I did not mess up with other studs, as these 3 were packed separately by Ken. Is that a big issue?

Thank you
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Last edited by Surcouf; 05-08-2020 at 10:53 AM. Reason: Adition
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  #142   IP: 24.152.132.140
Old 05-08-2020, 10:36 AM
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As a generic reply in the form of a question, if you cannot torque them to spec, what does that tell you?
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Old 05-08-2020, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by ndutton View Post
As a generic reply in the form of a question, if you cannot torque them to spec, what does that tell you?
not sure to understand..
- I was able to torque the manifold studs nuts to 25
- I have not tried to torque de thermostat housing nuts, as I am not fully sure of the torque. Should I go for 35 like the other head bolts?
Thank you
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Old 05-08-2020, 11:10 AM
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Perhaps it was I who did not understand the question. Per the MMI Service and Overhaul Manual, page 1-9, the head nuts including the thermostat housing are sequentially torqued to 25, 30 and finally 35 ft-lbs in the torque pattern pictured. An option of 30 ft-lbs. max is mentioned if the block threads are corroded.

You are correct on the manifold studs, 25 ft-lbs.
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Old 05-08-2020, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ndutton View Post
Perhaps it was I who did not understand the question. Per the MMI Service and Overhaul Manual, page 1-9, the head nuts including the thermostat housing are sequentially torqued to 25, 30 and finally 35 ft-lbs in the torque pattern pictured.
So I have my answer, and will torque as that value. Thank you!!
Note: I am also under the impression that I may have a very early version MM Manual, left by a PO in the boat, without all the most recent additions.
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Old 05-09-2020, 09:49 PM
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So stop at the boat today to remove the engine mount located Below the water pump, completely rusted so that I had to cut it, and both bolt heads were gone. It ended up being a very cordial discussion. I let you imagine the details of that talk through a picture...
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Old 05-09-2020, 09:57 PM
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So step by step getting there....
- Compression test: Engine cold all 4 cylinders at 90psi, or very close.
- with starter, And oil cold, oil pressure around 25 psi
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  #148   IP: 108.34.135.205
Old 05-10-2020, 04:38 PM
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So... heated the engine twice until 150F and torqued the head bolts to 35 lbf. But:
- it does not run idle at all, I have to «*hold it*» and play with starter and gas all the time to keep it from stalling. My spark plugs are quite sooty. First thing I a going to check is the TDC again with Don’s method. What else should I check?
- 2 of my head bolts are «*sipping water*». What should I do here? Remove these 2 nutS, add Permatex and rétorque? All studies were installed in the block with Permatex, no idea how water could make it that far

Thank you!!
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Last edited by Surcouf; 05-18-2020 at 07:41 AM. Reason: Typo
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Old 05-10-2020, 04:52 PM
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This may help you with the leaky head bolts.

Bill
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Old 05-10-2020, 05:59 PM
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This may help you with the leaky head bolts.

Bill
Thank you
I started right away. First one went as per Don’s words.
For The second one the studs came out. Pretty hard to seat properly once the head is one. I went full permatex for now. If it leaks again, I will go JB weld for the bottom of the stud, and I would cut a nut to be able to seat the stud properly.
Answer tomorrow, once everything is dry.

Thank you!
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