Way, Way Off-Topic Discussions - An Experiment

[lat 64]

I picked up the ipad2. Also purchased navonics hd. I like both so far. Does anyone know if the ipad2 requires one to have their 3GS enabled for it to work while on the boat. I thought I read somewhere that the ipad2 had an internal gps, in addition to the cell tower triangulation. It would be nice not to have to burn 3GS minutes while navigating. Take care, Russ

Up until a few days ago I thought my wife's Ipad was not equiped with GPS. We thought it was doing some fancy triangulating with the cell towers to give location.
My daughter was practicing to be car navigator for an upcomming road trip and they loaded some map application. Her mom says she shrieked and said" it's moving!" refering to the dot on the map. Thats when we took the time to read the instructions. At the time the 3g service was not current, so we realized it does have a GPS. As for the 3g service, we just pay once in a while when someone(wife) goes traveling and likes to have that convenience. I think it is a flat rate-around ten bucks—not sure about that.
We only have three roads in Alaska, so we never needed a GPs for the car.
They will got to Michigan, New York and parts in between next month. It should be a real asset on a road trip.

Ipad good. Ipad keep bored teenager happy. Mom happy. Much peace in car.
Dad stay home and drink beer.

Russ

[Paul Clarke]

I got my iPad 3G last June, and I use it daily. It's with me at work (I'm a teacher), at home, and on my C & C 27 here in BC.

As for navigation, there are two flavours of iPads. Only the iPad 3G has its own internal GPS antenna. The WiFi-only flavour does not have a GPS antenna, though for $100 you can purchase an external one that plays nicely with the iPad. On my iPad 3G, the internal GPS antenna is big and gives pinpoint fixes rapidly. The battery lasts for 10 hours on a single charge, and is quick to recharge, which on my boat is a priority. I use iNavX as my navigation software of choice, and love it (I have no connection to that company in any way other than as a happy customer). I still have all my paper charts, and I am meticulous with my log book (paper based for now). I have an older GPS unit as a backup, plus my iPhone with the Navionics app, but mostly I rely on my coastal piloting skills I've been using for 30 years. But as a chartplotter, the iPad is a great deal!

I've also been scanning in my operator's manuals (as PDFs) and have them on the iPad. With kids on board, watching a video now and again is also easy and fun. I've read more books in the last year than I've read in the last five, simply because it's convenient, and lightweight. With a 3G no-contract data plan for the iPad I can browse the web (not important for my parents, for example; it would never occur to them to do so, but my wife and kids and I do like to stay connected with Grandparents via pictures from our anchorage on Facebook, etc.), plus it allows you to browse forums such as this wonderful one when you're staring at the bottom of the shallow barrel that is your own personal knowledge base

Cost-wise, I don't think you can beat it. I'd love to have a big bright chartplotter that I can read from my sailboat's cockpit, but how many boat dollars for a 10" or 11" display? Compare that to $500 -700 for the iPad, $50 for the software, and widely available electronic charts. Although I don't use it, my software can act as a repeater for NMEA data, including MacENC on a Mac laptop over WiFi, external GPS antennas, AIS receivers, wind/depth instruments, etc. iNavX is rich in features, but easy to use, and is updated regularly (for free). There is no doubt about it, it is a very economical colour chartplotter. And, the iPad is big (over 9.5" diagonally) so you can see lots of the chart in one glance. You can pinch to scroll out (and iNavX refreshes the chart instantly), or stretch two fingers to zoom in. You don't get "lost" as you do on little displays where you see the detail you need but don't know what part of the chart you're viewing.

Downsides? The iPad is not waterproof. There is glare in bright sunlight. It is not a permanent installation.

I've actually ordered a waterproof case from DryCase (http://store.drycase.com/Waterproof-...et-p/dc-17.htm), because my cockpit is obviously open to the weather. In an enclosed bridge, being not permanently installed is actually an advantage... take it to the main salon to do research or online browsing, read a book or watch a movie in your cabin, or take it to the helm for navigation.

The upside? The iPad just works. Always. I'm not affiliated with Apple in any way, but it seems so much better than most laptops or desktop computers. It fires up in 1 second, is silent, doesn't give off heat, has a gorgeous display, and is as close to problem-free as any thing this side of a wooden stick. How could you not like a device where you solve a glitch by pressing the Home button? End of problem. No more fiddling with "why isn't this #?!##! thing WORKING?!?". Turn it on. It works.

The new iPad 2 is even thinner and lighter than the original (which, for a handheld device is surprisingly important), and it is even faster.

For others' opinions here are two people that I respect: the first is actually writing about 2 external GPS antennas that play nicely with the WiFi-only iPad (which does not have GPS), but he brings a good perspective to bear: http://goo.gl/tDi6d lots of good comments from users following his article... and for an alternative point of view, (ie: sort of against the iPad) http://www.madmariner.com/equipment/...TING_070610_EE

[rigspelt]

Celestial navigators and star-gazers will want to see the amazing sky chart apps for iPad and iPhone: move with you as you turn to look at the night sky.

The iPad marine chart packages are amazing -- even covers Canada. Navionics' echarts for iPad are far cheaper than the marine echarts we've been used to.

[TomG]

Navionics' echarts for iPad are far cheaper than the marine echarts we've been used to.

And much, much easier to use.

[gclayton]

Over the past few weeks, TomG and I have swapped a couple of postings (and then a couple of PM’s) on the subject of how the Apple iPad might be used on the water. Obviously, this is pushing the envelope regarding “off-topic” discussion. Nevertheless, it frustrates me a bit at times that we deliberately limit the discussion matter when we have this wonderful collection of forum members whose experience, education, intuition, judgment, etc. challenge and entertain me every day. The intentions are honorable, but I’d like to try something that might interest like-minded individuals, without distracting or flat-out aggravating those members who appreciate the clarity of “mission” in the forum.

Our forum software has the ability to establish what it calls “public groups” – discussion categories which a member may join and view/post if desired, but will otherwise not be visible. I’d like to give it a try, and TomG has agreed to join me in the first iteration – a group dedicated to the iPad discussion we dabbled with earlier.

To join us (or simply to see how the whole thing works), click on the “User CP” option on the main navigation menu. Then select the “Group Memberships” option on the left side, which will display a list of user groups you are free to join. From there, it’s a matter of a couple of clicks.
Joining the “iPad User Group” will make visible a new discussion category, called “iPad Applications on the Water,” which will appear in the Off-Topic group towards the bottom of the page. Join the group and you’ll see this. Choose not to join, and you won’t.

Feedback regarding the idea (not simply this first rather specific iteration) would be appreciated. If you’d like to suggest another subject for a different group, please reply here or drop me a PM. I don’t really have a sense of where we’d draw the line as to what’s ok and what isn’t, beyond the broad requirements of decorum and taste. We’ll take ‘em as they come.

Bill

Bill

I agree having a tablet on the water would be a huge advantage but also have an problem with Apples restrictive way of doing business. The windows operating system is too clunky. My company has gone to an OEM to have one built for us based on the android operating system 3.0. Our first hard copy is due next week and is speced to blow all the others "out of the water" Pun intended. George

[smaarch]

Paul

nice assessment and i'll have to rethink my view of ipad vs laptop.
can an ipad edit an view documents produced on windows based machines?
word docs, spreadsheets, pdf's for example.
if it can, you may have just convinced me.

thanks

[sastanley]

Bill

I agree having a tablet on the water would be a huge advantage but also have an problem with Apples restrictive way of doing business. The windows operating system is too clunky. My company has gone to an OEM to have one built for us based on the android operating system 3.0. Our first hard copy is due next week and is speced to blow all the others "out of the water" Pun intended. George

George...this is my opinion of Apple as well.. I just don't like 'em!

Android has been advertised as exactly the solution you describe...not as clunky as Windows, & not restrictive like Apple...let's hope its development continues. I am currently using an Android 2.2 smartphone (my first android device) and so far I like it. It runs the navionics chartplotting software pretty well and is a great backup to the GPS/laptop combo I currently use.

[roadnsky]

...can an ipad edit an view documents produced on windows based machines?
word docs, spreadsheets, pdf's for example.

Yes you can view and edit Word and Excel docs.
Not sure if there's a full Adobe App yet to EDIT a PDF yet.
(I say YET, cause if there isn't, be sure there WILL be one)
BUT you can certainly VIEW a PDF.

[rigspelt]

The iPad marine chart packages are amazing -- even covers Canada. Navionics' echarts for iPad are far cheaper than the marine echarts we've been used to.

And much, much easier to use.

How many chartplotter functions do iPad marine e-chart display programs provide?
- waypoint creation/manipulation?
- route creation/editing?
- route navigation?
- distance and bearing from point to cursor?

Update: I think I answered my own question. iNavX can, I think, create and edit waypoints on the iPad, and provide distance/bearing measurements. My plan:
1. iNavX app for iPad $50. http://www.inavx.com/ and its forums are at MacSailing.net.
2. Fugawi's X-Traverse account $10/include e-chart purchase and GRIB data.
3. Navionics vector chart package for the whole of Canada (and SE Alaska for wet-coasters) via X-Traverse $30. CHS raster charts are much more expensive ($170 for part of our local region) but available. Free NOAA charts work with iNavX too.
4. AyeTides app $10 (was Mr. Tides).

[W2ET]

Bumped re "Public Groups." Read the whole thing.

Bill

[ndutton]

Influenced by this thread and contrary to my comments in post #6 (10 years ago) I tried an iPad with iNavX including AIS mounted at the helm. Everything worked except the screen was unreadable in daylight. I tried a glare screen overlay but still no joy.

Cheapskate that I am I bought the iPad refurbished off of eBay, it eventually went through an automatic update that locked me out without a password - that I did not have. I was able to do a clean wipe and restore operation but lost iNavX in the process. Attempting to reload iNavX, the current version was not compatible with my iPad operating system and no later operating system is available for my age of iPad nor is an older version of iNavX available (I tried).

I have an old monochrome chart plotter inside the boat at the nav station that still works great but is way too big to consider helm mounting. It looks like if I want chart plotting function at the helm that I can read in daylight I'm in the market for a real, full monty plotter.

[W2ET]

I just noticed that the latest Navionics update isn't compatible with my old iPad either. Bummer.

AFAIK, there is no version of OpenCpn for the iPad.

Bill

[ndutton]

It's a non-issue for me, couldn't see the screen anyway.

[CRUX]

I've used navionics exclusively on an iPad (with paper as backups) to cruise the northeast for the past 7 years. Works great for me. Is accurate, intuitive and dependable in my experience.

Only downside being the sun (I put a captains hat over it during the day), and on rainy days I have another mount under the dodger.

Not "professional" but no complaints yet. Just make sure to keep tons of extra charging cables aboard as the salt gets to them fast.

[joe_db]

I've used navionics exclusively on an iPad (with paper as backups) to cruise the northeast for the past 7 years. Works great for me. Is accurate, intuitive and dependable in my experience.

Only downside being the sun (I put a captains hat over it during the day), and on rainy days I have another mount under the dodger.

Not "professional" but no complaints yet. Just make sure to keep tons of extra charging cables aboard as the salt gets to them fast.

How is AIS support on Navionics?