There was a reference to "lubing the advance" - how & where

[Don Moyer]

Shawn, it must be a real luxury to have a step dad with such good mechanical skills to look over your shoulder. Please give him our best regards, I'm a step dad myself. Don

[sastanley]

Don, thanks, it is...he helped me rebuild my first 1237cc Honda Civic motor (not much larger than an A4!) when I was a teenager in the 80's..probably what got me hooked on wrenchin'.

Tom, Now that I know it, I don't think I'll forget. The key is to remember Don's tips...spinning the distributor clockwise and having the springs forcefully pulling back against you, assures your indexing pin is in the correct hole in the plate underneath. If you have not fully re-assembled the distributor you can also see the weights in action too..it really is a simple but ingenious design.

[roadnsky]

By chance did you take any pictures for the visually challenged amongst us?

[sastanley]

To follow up, after polishing the inner and outer shafts of the distributor with 600 grit paper and lubing with MMO, the engine ran great for two hours this evening in varying conditions and RPMs. Sorry I didn't take pics of the corrosion inside the dizzy, but the point is when you take your Delco apart to do the weights, clean and lube the shafts too. I think I had a piece of trash in between the shafts scoring/binding things up and causing problems. Blasting it with carb cleaner and lubing with MMO should take care of that.

edit - Jerry, what pics are you looking for..disassembled Delco dizzy? The weight/spring action? Talk to me brother, and I'll work on it when I am not busy cruising or something.

[rkohl44]

Originally Posted by ndutton

Remove the distributor cap, remove the rotor, remove the magnetic EI collar, remove the round flat plate that holds the EI module. You'll find the centrifugal advance weights underneath the flat plate with small springs on them. Make sure they move freely by hand and lubricate.

I installed my EI 3 years ago and for the life of me, I can't remember how the magnetic EI collar goes on. I think it just pushes down, but I didn't want to force it pulling up to get it off. Is there a trick to pulling it off, or just pull harder?

[ndutton]

It is a snug fit, pulls straight off.

[ronstory]

It's just a pulls up and slides off the shaft, but I would still be gentle. If the plastic case cracks... that's annoying.

[rkohl44]

Thanks, both. Pull harder it is.

[ronstory]

... gently.

[rkohl44]

I got the magnetic collar off, the plate off and found this inside. Oiled it up and everything moves well. The question is, due to the amount of rust, should I remove the distributor and super clean everything inside? Are replacement parts available? This is apparently the first time this distributor has ever been looked into since 1982.

[thatch]

If it were my distributor, I would pull it and completely clean it, however, before pulling it I would replace the rotor and make a mark showing which direction it is pointed. I would then make two marks at the base of the housing, one on the housing itself and one on the accessory drive. That way you can re-install it without having to re-time the ignition. Some of the internal parts can be lightly painted to slow down the rust cycle but other things, like the fly weights, should be left bare. Finally, if you go that far, Moyer sells springs that are far superior to the originals.
Tom

[ronstory]

Eew... That's Gooey.

I would take it apart and wipe off the rust you can with a paper towel and then stuff the pieces in a ziplock bag and add vinegar. Check it in 24 hour and if it's not clean check it one day later.

Dump the vinegar from the bag, add water and with baking soda and 'mix' a bit and do one final rinse with hot water. Then wipe dry and spray or wipe with a light oil.

Thatch has great pointers to avoid having to retime the engine... and get new springs.

[Pweismann23]

Hi -
I've got a 72 Ranger 33 in Berkeley.

I replaced the points with the electronic ignitor. What is the clearance between the magnetic collar and the magnetic sense supposed to be? And is this adjustment significant enough that the engine would not start unless correctly adjusted? Mine is .025.

With a new MM coil, the spark I get from the centre coil wire to ground at the block isn't impressive. If the voltage across the pos and neg of the coil is 12 volts, and the ohms 3.5 - 3.6, does that ensure that the plugs is sufficient and that the little spark I saw is good enough? Likewise the spark across the plugs looks anemic to me.

Last, will the engine not start if the rotor is not in the direction specified in the video?

Thanks for your help.

Paul
Mojo Berkeley

[Dave Neptune]

Paul, first welcome to the MMI Forum.

You need to have a "crisp, snappy blue spark", especially with the EI.

RE the rotor and where it points. In the video it is pointing where "that" engine has had it's distributor installed when timed. The original from the factory setting is "like that" for quick assembly at the factory. If the distributor has ever been "removed" that position could change.

If you have not removed the distributor or the wires you should be OK. If you plan on removing do so at TDC on the firing stroke of #1 and mark the case where the rotor points and mark the block where the distributor mounts, then you can be sure on "your" engine.

Dave Neptune

[paulw]

Hi,
I am new Afourian. About the springs and counter weights: what is the mechanism that changes when the plugs fire, how is the advance accomplished, and why is it necessary?

I replaced my points with the ei, got a new carb, I hope this is the solution to no power in forward. It's time for a water trial. I'd love to know the reason and how for the advanced timing.

Would appreciate any education.

Paul

[sastanley]

Originally Posted by Pweismann23

Hi -
I've got a 72 Ranger 33 in Berkeley.

I replaced the points with the electronic ignitor. What is the clearance between the magnetic collar and the magnetic sense supposed to be? And is this adjustment significant enough that the engine would not start unless correctly adjusted? Mine is .025.

With a new MM coil, the spark I get from the centre coil wire to ground at the block isn't impressive. If the voltage across the pos and neg of the coil is 12 volts, and the ohms 3.5 - 3.6, does that ensure that the plugs is sufficient and that the little spark I saw is good enough? Likewise the spark across the plugs looks anemic to me.

Last, will the engine not start if the rotor is not in the direction specified in the video?

Thanks for your help.

Paul
Mojo Berkeley

Paul, there is also a vertical alignment needed so the magnetic ring lines up. It is a sung fit as mentioned a little farther up in this thread, and the ring technically can only go on one way (it has a 'collar' on one side) to limit how far down you can press it on the shaft. I had to break off the collar and slide mine just a bit more than intended to line it up with the EI unit and get spark.

[Dave Neptune]

Paul, the advance is necessary for proper performance. When idling AT LOW RPM's the engine runs best with the timing at about 0* or TDC (top dead center), however as the engine speeds up the "fire" needs to start a bit sooner so the expansion is pushing the piston down for good power. At these higher RPM's from IDLE to around 1600 RPM's the timing needs to advance the "time of the fire" to around 34* to make good power and run smoothly.

It is the CENTRIFUGAL advance that does this. The "COUNTER SHAFT" can advance the point of the spark as the advance weights move out against the springs and the cam (the plates with the groove) that advances the timing to 34* and then stops at 1600RPM's. This happens in all engines some mechanically like the A-4 and the newer computer controlled ones electronically.

Dave Neptune