This drives the point home

[ndutton]

Who among us hasn't fielded comments from our diesel snob acquaintances about the danger of our gasoline engines? Have you ever heard the magnificently clever slur Atomic Bomb? Of course you have. What about the highly regarded featured contributor on another forum who once wrote (and I quote) "The one good thing that I have heard about gas engines in sailboats is that they don't need as much warm up so that, if you need power in a hurry in a tight spot, you can just turn the igni...BOOM!"

For years I've had a stock response locked and loaded for these times that goes something like this:
Yeah, well tell me, what cooking fuel do you have on your diesel powered boat? Propane? It has roughly the same explosive force as gasoline, its vapors are heavier than air like gasoline but unlike gasoline it is stored under pressure which is not a property in its favor. You'd never set foot on a gasoline powered boat yet you cook merrily away on your "safe" diesel powered boat don't cha?

Here is something that makes the point in spades

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=652&v=pDqQpPJy7MQ&feature=emb_logo

(I don't know why it starts over half way through, you'll have to slide the progress bar to the beginning on your own)
Sorry about the ads

[dvd]

Atomic bomb

Yes I get this quite a bit. People ask me about the danger and if atomic 4s blow up. I usually respond stating “yes I heard a few of them exploding just the other day.”

[romantic comedy]

I tell people that almost all pleasure boats are gas powered.

[joe_db]

Don't make light of the dangers of gasoline, a sistership to mine suffered a gasoline explosion, burned, and sank
This was I am 99% sure related to an issue with how C&C designed the fuel system and not caused by anything on the A4. The tank is tucked under the cockpit and the fill hose has to do a 90 degree turn in little space. C&C used some rubber 90 degree elbow they likely found at a local hardware store intended for kitchen sinks. It did fine with gasoline, but was never intended for that use and ethanol gas was far off in the future at that time.
I went to refuel my boat in Rock Hall and ended up with half the gas in the tank and half in the bilge.: The boat that burned had likewise just refueled. I figured it out when the blower fumes just about knocked me out, so I did not end up hitting the starter button. Crawling around looking for the leak I found the rubber elbow was dissolving and ripped

Back to diesel boat owners, I once got a lecture about the horrible dangers of gasoline engines from one such and then he opened the hatch to the engine room and got a Clorox bottle full of gasoline out from behind the engine to fuel his dinghy. Of course he had a propane stove too We also need to remember that probably 90% of the boats in the USA that move under power are fueled with gasoline. How to handle it safely has been known for many decades now.

[Surcouf]

this is pretty scary... I assume this was a propane leak?
I have always seen my father closing the gas bottle on the boat anytime we were not using the stove... always was under the impression he was just over-careful. Damn... even for that one he was right! On the other hand, I have also become a safety freak as he was regarding anchoring, chain length etc...

[joe_db]

Imagine a house built like a boat. Your bedroom is in the basement. We have some gasoline tanks in the basement and propane tanks too. We even have a gasoline engine in the basement and the exhaust hose runs along the floor and then out through a wall.
No one would EVER allow such a thing to be built nor occupied as a dwelling. We need to be careful!

[Dave Neptune]

Boats are bombs

I have been there for 2 boat explosions and fires. One was an LP explosion at Santa Cruz Island. Don't know what leaked but the result was a 35' PB exploding right next to us at anchor. The owner was aboard with a few of us from the anchorage having a "pot luck" and lying contest. As the evening wore on we ran out of Scotch and he had another bottle on his boat. He went to retrieve it and was lighting a smoke when he slid the door open~~BOOM~~he was pushed back across the cockpit, hit the rail and landed about 20 feet from his boat. The entire deck raised and fell as well as all the windows blown out. My buddy and I jumped in the get to him. He was slightly burned, mostly hair and had some very sore legs where he hit the transom, his "bell" was well rung. We got him aboard and watched his boat burn in the night. The CG arrived in time to see the boat sink and a Helo took him to Santa Barbara. A real scare indeed.

The other was a family trailerable power cruiser about 25" or so. They just filled up and the boat blew up at the dock when he hit the key. There were 11 people on the boat and 5 died. One a 4 year old kid I pulled out of the water was missing a leg just below the knee. I found his leg under water and got it to the Helo just as they were taking him and his dad who later died in flight. This too was a filler hose problem.

All boats are bombs unless properly operated and safely maintained!!!

Dave Neptune

[JOHN COOKSON]

All boats are bombs unless properly operated and safely maintained!!!
Dave Neptune

I was down at the marina one evening at dusk. I could hear someone grinding on the starter on a power boat. The flash and shock wave were unforgettable. The operator was blown into the water.
It was determined that the explosion happened because gasoline was in the bilge. Apparently while he was cranking the gas was going into bilge rather than into the engine.
Lesson: Don't grind on the starter. If the engine does not start normally figure out why. + it is hard on the starter. Short cranking bursts on the starter with pauses between tries. + cooling water might be flooding the exhaust and end up in the engine.

ex TRUE GRIT

[Mo]

all the time.

Oh, the latest, there was a diesel mechanic in the club last year working on a guy's boat. He looked at mine and was impressed, and asked what was in it for an engine. When I told him A4 he started....I stopped him and I'll quote "listen here Sunshine, this engine was made in 1976 and still running perfect. You are rebuilding a diesel engine in a 2001 boat that has hardly left the dock". Two days later (he's still working on that boat) he stops by and tells me I have a point. Later found out the boys cued him in.

[joe_db]

If diesels actually lasted as long as some urban legends have it, no diesel powered recreational boat would EVER need a new engine
The ones that so make the mythical 10 or 20 thousand hours are engine like the Ford Lehman that are slow turning industrial engines that get used near daily.
No engine can live out its natural lifespan sitting unused most of the time.

[Sam]

I'll make one last comment. A few years ago my younger brother's boss, a fire house chief, had his 30ft power boat in a harbor next to mine. Over winter layup he left the stove propane tank on board. When he got to the harbor he lit a cig and the cabin blew off the boat at the deck. He was blown into the water with burning cushion melted on to his skin etc. He survived but not well. The working theory was that the tank/stove valves leaked due to temp changes and the propane collected on the low cabin floor.

[ndutton]

The similar properties between gasoline and propane should be well known to boat owners who have either and by the posts here it is obvious our forum members are well informed. However, as for the USCG and ABYC, maybe not so much.

Our gasoline fuel has vapors that are heavier than air that will collect in the bilge or other low areas in the event of a leak therefore spark producing components and appliances are required to meet ignition proof standards SAE J1171 or UL 1500 and the boat is also required to have a fixed powered bilge ventilation system. Boats with propane on board are also required to have ignition proof electrical appliances but there is NO REQUIREMENT FOR A POWERED BILGE VENTILATION SYSTEM that I could find researching the standards of both agencies. This makes no practical sense to me.

In the case of Aussie Magnus and Nutshell, such a ventilation system installed and operated exactly the same as ours might have prevented his explosion or at least reduced the force and therefore the damage. I repeat, gasoline and propane vapors are both heavier than air, both collect in the bilge and both have similar explosive force. Both require spark producing appliances to be ignition proof yet only one requires a powered ventilation system. For those of us with propane cooking fuel it would make sense to apply the exhaust blower protocol (exactly the same as we do when starting the engine) every time we use propane.

[zellerj]

While we are on the subject - Another safety tip about propane

A friend of mine was seriously injured using his built in gas barbecue, you know, the ones were the propane tanks are underneath in a cabinet that is not vented. Fumes congregated in the cabinet from a small leak and when he went to light his grill, boom.

Please make sure your outdoor gas grill has a propane storage locker that is vented.

[Ando]

This may be a suitable concern here. My electric space heater is rated UL 1275 and double electric burner just says “UL Rated”, but it’s 1500w if that helps. When I have both of them on, the breaker flips...well it flipped yesterday. The first time I had them both on at the same time the breaker didn’t flip. What happened was that the connection between the on shore power cable and the boat was singed so bad that I had to replace both the on board connection and the cord.

[joe_db]

I too suffered a propane explosion injury. When it was dinnertime I discovered wasps had built a nest in the grill
This should be easy to solve - turn the gas on - count to 30 - stick the lighter in the hole. I'll burn those damn wasps right on out of there.
BOOM
It was like getting punched by Mike Tyson when the grill top flew up, the grates flew overboard, and then after recovering from the gut punch I had a nice propane sunburn The crew thought this was GREAT and wanted to see it again!

* it did work, burnt wasps were launched in all directions and none survived