Just another overhaul thread

**Surcouf** · 09-03-2019, 04:29 PM

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**Surcouf** · 09-03-2019, 04:31 PM

last pictures

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**Al Schober** · 09-03-2019, 10:49 PM

I take it the engine still runs. If you have 'Winter' where you are, that's a good time to pull the engine and get it someplace to work on until the return of sailing season.
There's a lot of corrosion there - the head corrosion is unusual. My question is: What's dripping on the engine?
Don't let the corrosion scare you. A little iron make a LOT of rust. You've got your work cut out for you cleaning that up. Buy a face shield or at least safety glasses with side shields. Like the safety poster says 'Protect your eye'.
Head may not be toast. Depends on what happens when you remove the spark plugs. They can be removed - it just depends on how much of the head goes along with them.
Removing the engine from a Cat27 is a challenge - no experience with that, just glad I had a Tar30! There are Cat27 folks here who will guide you.

**TomG** · 09-04-2019, 08:21 AM

Are you sure it's the head? The rust and corrosion around that #1 plug looks bad enough that maybe the leak you hear is simply the spark plug being compromised? Like Al mentioned, I would get in there with a Dremel and a wire brush (and all the safety gear like goggles and masks and a shop vac, etc.) and clean the area up first.

You obviously have some problems, primarily, what is causing all the rust on and around the engine? I'd be looking to fix that pronto.

Secondly, you are overdue for new spark plugs. Past overdue. Removing them now is going to be an adventure. Depending on what is found after cleaning things up, there might be an obvious breach in the head, in which case I would pull the engine and move it the shop for a rebuild. If the head looks okay, I'd try to remove the plugs in place with the expectation that one or more plugs is going to break off in the hole. Then I would pull the engine and move it to the shop for a rebuild.

IMHO, you might get lucky and be able to pull the plugs intact and replace them. At this point, I think you'll be lucky if you don't have a plug break apart. I'd be seriously contemplating the best way/time to pull the engine and catch up on maintenance while standing up in a warm shop versus contorted in a cold bilge.

Best of luck!

**tenders** · 09-06-2019, 01:04 AM

I think you’ll need to replace the head and the engine mounts but the rest of the engine doesn’t look bad at all. Check what you can with it out of the boat and with the head off, but if she’s running well now...the right answer MIGHT be to wire brush what rust you can, put on a couple of coats of new paint, and put her right back in.

**Surcouf** · 10-29-2019, 01:28 PM

And what had to happen.....

So life is funny.

after allowing us to enjoy the Labor day week-end, and a few other nice days of fall sailing, Saturday was "moving day" from the "summer marina", to the "winter dry marina". Beautiful day on Narragansett Bay, engine takes us out of the marina, sails are set, easy sailing for the 2-3 miles to Warwick, RI. Arriving at the harbor channel entrance, furl sail, start engine, and engage our boat into the channel. At this point, the Sea Tow boat passes us... as a good superstitious sailor, I should have known it was a bad sign... 100 yards later, engine starts making a weird noise, and shut down. I try to re-start it, it starts right back-up (with an increased "whistle noise", aka the combustion gases leak), as soon as I engage the prop, it shuts down. So sailor get back in action: with the remaining inertia, U-turn toward the bay, sail out and back to Safety of the open sea.
Fast forward a few minutes once anchored safely, I checked on the engine... and miracle!!! my 3-years stuck spark-plug is moving!! Moving so much I was able to pull it up, without any rotation!! let's call that a bad sign...
Call to the insurance towing department, who ask his usual scripted questions. Once he knows where I am and what happened, he asks for the name of the boat, I answer the truth: "Almost There", and here we go for 5 minutes of an uncontrollable laughing session!

Fast forward today: boat is at the marina, and the head is likely very damaged.

My situation: I am supposed to ditch / donate that boat as I will be leaving the US next year. So I have no appetite to spend big bucks in an overhauled engine etc... But I like that boat and its engine despite its temperamental character, and I would love to know it is sailing again in the future. So I am willing to spend some little money (and a lot of time) to have a running engine again.

My assumptions - ideas:
- the head is dead. This seems easy based on the spark plug moving up and down like a piston, and previous pictures. Anybody to disagree?
- the best case for me is to pull the engine out (it is a Catalina 27, impossible to remove a rusty head while in place), take the head out, remove all the studs, find a used one, put all back together, paint the whole thing and put it back in place. I can feel this is going to be a huge amount of time... but what I am looking at money-wise, best case? A used head, gaskets, new studs? new engine mounts? ((I do not even want to consider what can go wrong on a very rusty engine disassembly))
- Any other idea // Comment??

Thank you !!!

**jcwright** · 10-29-2019, 06:10 PM

Hello Surcouf.

I see you are nearby and perhaps in need of a replacement head. When I rebuilt my A4 a couple of years ago I decided to get a new MMI head. This was overkill on my part, as compression and cooling were good; please don't tell my wife. You are welcome to the old head. I commute from Narragansett to Providence workdays, and could meet you somewhere in between. Let me know if you're interested.

Best regards,

Jack

**Surcouf** · 10-29-2019, 10:47 PM

Of course I am interested! I contact you directly.
Thank you!

**jcwright** · 10-30-2019, 08:44 PM

I've sent you a PM with additional information.

-Jack

**edwardc** · 10-31-2019, 11:53 AM

If the only problem is that the spark plug hole is stripped out, you may be able to simply put in a helicoil. I used to do this on my Volkswagen engines, as the aluminum heads they used stripped or cross-threaded easily.

**Surcouf** · 11-02-2019, 08:22 PM

Engine removal questions

Hello,

So I recruited my father in law, and after 3 hours of efforts:
- all cables disconnected (there are way too many electrical wires on this engine...)
- 2 engine silent blocks fully loose (top nut and both bottom screws)
- silent block below water pump: both bottom screws are fully rusted, the “bolt-heads” of those screws are totally rusted round, nothing to do here, but I could remove the top nut
- alternator removed, shaft disconnected, water lines removed, exhaust disconnected, water pump removed
- the front starboard is gnome block: one of the 2 bottom screw is rounded, other one removed. Top nut not coming out. Sawzall ready for tomorrow...

The remaining issues and questions
- starter: how do you remove the starter? We have removed the two bolts located “behind the flywheel”. But how do I remove the starter from there? Is there a hidden bolt? A trick? ((I went quickly through the MM manual, could not find anything on how to remove starter
- weight: what halyard do you use to lift the engine? Main sail and front sail together (to split the load)? How much does an engine weight? How much tension is a halyard able to take during sailing?

Thank you!!!