Engine quitting when it reaches 160

[Orion C&C 33]

I know this might be a silly question, but is your manual the Moyer Marine, Inc. manual or is it a version of an OEM manual? I have several versions of the OEM manual , all were available in PDF format, as well as a copy of the MMI manual, which is only offered in print.

That said, I will admit to scanning my copy to a PDF file I keep on a dedicated tablet that works as my "universal device manual library"


I printed off the pdf version... needed something really quick to get the specs to get the gap right on my spark plugs.

Very handy I must say!

[Ram41662]

Yeh, TBH, I find each manual, even some of the odd parts list, handy in their own way, which is why I keep them all available in the shop.

The Moyer Marine manual is considered "The One Book to Rule Them All" by a lot of folks. I personally find it very handy and quite straight forward to use; a definite "must have" for long term Atomic 4 ownership.

[Orion C&C 33]

My apologies for my delay in response...


Your starting fluid test and dry #1 plug both confirm a fuel problem but let's not jump to conclusions it's the pump. It's possible it is, just that nothing's conclusive yet. Your symptoms may be due to other causes, even a combination of causes. Hard starting may be caused by a poorly functioning choke not closing all the way. A non-functioning fuel pump may be due to a failed oil pressure safety switch (OPSS). I encourage you to explore the entire fuel system before replacing things, home in on the real problem first. A fuel pressure gauge immediately ahead of the carburetor would answer a lot of questions about now.[/QUOTE]

Found a quicker way to test the fuel pump, disconnected the line to the carburetor.. placed the end into a empty water bottle container and had someone push the start button... Confirmed no fuel is being pumped.

Then I disconnected the fuel line from the fuel filter to FP, no blockages the fuel flows freely.

Changed out the pump with an Acent electric pump... the motor started almost immediately! Been testing with multiple start tests over the weekend.

It's a sweet sound when the motor starts within seconds.

Thank you for your advice... much appreciated.

Cheers,

Mel

[Dave Neptune]

Did you check the OPSS wiring to be sure the pump was energized and supplying fuel during the start sequence?

Dave Neptune

[joe_db]

A fuel pressure gauge and jumping the OPSS would both be good things here.
Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I

[Orion C&C 33]

Did you check the OPSS wiring to be sure the pump was energized and supplying fuel during the start sequence?

Dave Neptune

Hello Dave... Yes, it was a dead fuel pump and once I changed it out there has been no further issues starting it up.

Cheers,
Mel

[Orion C&C 33]

A fuel pressure gauge and jumping the OPSS would both be good things here.
Joe
Coquina
C&C 35 MK I

I think so too... but I only have 6" if that to do what you suggested. I running out of room between the main fuel filter ahead of the pump and a new inline filter between the pump and the carburetor.

As mentioned in an earlier thread there is not much room on the carburetor side of things...

Cheers

Mel

[Dave Neptune]

Mel, the gage can be mounted in a visible spot and connected with a "loop" in the hose. And a convenient place to mount a shut off valve is the gage. The gage eliminates an awful lot of guessing.

Dave Neptune

[Orion C&C 33]

Mel, the gage can be mounted in a visible spot and connected with a "loop" in the hose. And a convenient place to mount a shut off valve is the gage. The gage eliminates an awful lot of guessing.

Dave Neptune

Hey Dave...

I've read somewhere on this site that those low pressure gauges are hard to find... Yes, you are right installing a gauge will take a lot of guess work out.

My mechanical skills have been limited to animatronics, servicing servo linkages and motors. So this is all new to me.

Although intimidating at first when I looked at this motor, I've come to appreciate it simplicity.


Cheers David!

Mel

[Sam]

$20 US buys a good one on EBAY _ Russell, Marshall, Jeggs etc. I bought "Marshall" 0 to 15psi since it was stainless case w/real glass lens this year. I chose "liquid filled" [vs air filled] and it performs fine to date. Brass hose "t" adaptor was another $12. Having this gauge is highly recommended by the pros on this site and for good reason.

[Orion C&C 33]

Heated coil

It seems after dealing with a myriad of issues with my neglected Atomic 4... Yesterdays incident has led me to back to some suggestions by other members of this forum.

Although my engine is running 100 times better... It failed again this weekend after running for almost 11 hrs getting back to my slip up river.

To put it in perspective running up the Fraser river from the salt chuck can be challenging with strong enough currents making your motoring vessel stand still, making 0 knots for headway in a busy shipping lane.

To get to the point... my engine ran hot enough even with the blower on to cool the engine compartment and the lazaret locker open to let the heat out on a blistering hot day such as yesterday. As pointed out by my partner the water line to the sink was hot and it is a cold water line that is piped thru the engine compartment. The gear box was extremely hot to the touch as with other parts of the engine.

It ran for most of this 11 hour journey at ( no wind )... Engine temp was 160 / oil pressure 50 lbs / rpm 2000

I have a heat exchanger pulling raw water to a closed system... and yes it is discharging thru the back and my anti-freeze levels are at it's correct level

As I came to dock my engine died suddenly and wouldn't re-start on command... I still had enough momentum to carry me away from the dock and steered out to avoid colliding with another member's boat. I hastily dropped anchor to avoid drifting into other boats in this crowded narrow channel lined with moored boats

I am suspecting that my coil had overheated and just shut off... as I can do nothing till it cooled down again same old problem that hasn't reared it's head for a while

Can anyone confirm by removing the coil off the engine block and mounting to the bulkhead will solve this problem that was too hot to touch yesterday. Prior to that, it was tested and produced a strong blue spark.

I am going to replace it since I believe that the excessive heat may have damaged the unit anyways... I just would like some input if anyone else has their coil mounted on the bulkhead.

Cheers

Mel

[roadnsky]

...my engine ran hot enough even with the blower on to cool the engine compartment and the lazaret locker open to let the heat out on a blistering hot day such as yesterday.

It ran for most of this 11 hour journey at ( no wind )... Engine temp was 160 / oil pressure 50 lbs / rpm 2000

Mel-
An engine temp at 160° is not hot.
Especially for a fresh water (coolant) system.

Are you getting that engine temp reading on your meter or are you using a temp "gun"?

my engine died suddenly and wouldn't re-start on command...

Your stall sounds like a coil issue.
You may want to read this thread.

• What coil do you have?
• Do you know it's resistance?
• Do you have EI?

[joe_db]

This is my fuel pressure setup. Bonus - a red light comes on when the pressure is below 1 PSI.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pressure-transducer-sender-5-psi-stainless-steel-for-oil-fuel-air-water/251520321321?hash=item3a8fc78729:g:3PoAAOSw~qNZgzUt

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pressure-Transducer-Gauge-5-psi-2-1-16-52mm-analog-voltage-input-LED-light/262058478258?hash=item3d03e70ab2:g:0McAAOSwUBlZsJt0

IMHO being able to see the fuel pressure underway is very useful.

[Marty Levenson]

Coil on bulkhead with heatsink

Hey Mel,

Sure was hot here on Bowen yesterday too! I can imagine that 2000 RPM for 11 hours generated some serious heat in the engine compartment.

We did move our coil to the bulkhead when we went to electronic ignition and a new coil. Before that, we had a couple years of shutdowns. As an added precaution we mounted the coil on a hunk of scrap aluminum as a heat sink.

good luck!

[ndutton]

It's perfectly normal for humans to attempt to make order out of chaos and to that end I think conclusions are being drawn without real evidence. For example:

• It is highly unusual for a coil to function perfectly for 11 hours and then die. Not impossible, but exceedingly rare.
• The time to test for spark is immediately after the unexpected shut down. If it was an overheated coil it will appear to heal itself after it cools but don't be fooled into complacency, it's damaged beyond reliability - IF it really was the coil.
• The engine room blower is not there to cool the engine. Sure, it moves a little air but not anywhere near enough to make a temperature difference.
• As Roadnsky said, 160° is cool for a FWC A4 but still hot to the touch. Touch tests don't tell us a lot unless it's for beer.

So, as of this time we don't know if the shut down was spark or fuel related as there has been no conclusive tests performed. Testing for spark after cool down provides zero information pertinent to the shut down unless there is still no spark. We have no fuel pressure information at the time of shut down so a fuel issue is not yet off the table either.

There is no harm in relocating the coil off the engine but at this time such a modification is on a hope and a prayer based on a suspicion. Answers to Roadnsky's questions will help in assessing your ignition system.