Return to the home page...

Go Back   Moyer Marine Atomic 4 Community - Home of the Afourians > Discussion Topics > Troubleshooting

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1   IP: 71.181.37.53
Old 07-20-2010, 07:09 AM
ArtJ ArtJ is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,177
Thanks: 221
Thanked 65 Times in 50 Posts
Reply to safe operating temperature

From the way you describe your fancey temperature control I suspect
that you may have a Indigo regulator valve installed. If the valve is
overheated from lack of cooling water to boiling point, it can melt internally per Tom Stevens of indigo. I suggest contacting Indigo Electronics to determine if this is the case, as well as obtaining a installation procedure
for the valve. This valve works great if used properly.

Regards

Art
Reply With Quote
  #2   IP: 173.166.26.245
Old 07-20-2010, 07:56 AM
hanleyclifford's Avatar
hanleyclifford hanleyclifford is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,978
Thanks: 172
Thanked 280 Times in 226 Posts
To answer one of your questions; an engine running at 130 degrees could not generate enough heat to fry the coil. The coil problem is not related to engine heat. Do you have the electronic ignition or points and condenser? This subject of coils is being exhaustively discussed on this forum. Please give us the particulars of your ignition system.
Reply With Quote
  #3   IP: 24.152.131.220
Old 07-20-2010, 08:02 AM
ndutton's Avatar
ndutton ndutton is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Posts: 9,619
Thanks: 198
Thanked 2,208 Times in 1,425 Posts
Wonder why the original thread is closed? Thanks Art for continuing on here.

Paul,

The highest temp you report is 190. That doesn't seem off the scale to me for a FWC engine and I wouldn't expect it to be the root of your performance/running problems. That's not to say you shouldn't chase down the fluctuating temperature. In my experience, the A4 operating temp is rock steady. My raw water cooled engine operates within a 10 degree range depending on RPM and that's on its own, no manual bypass valve.

Then why the performance issue? The coil's been replaced and it still gets hot, way hot. I'm immediately drawn to what type of ignition you have and a potential mismatch of the coil. You report the engine was well maintained and it has FWC. I think any owner that goes the FWC route likely also has electronic ignition.

Do you?

If so, not just any coil will do. It needs a coil with 3 ohm internal resistance. Without the proper coil you risk damaging it and the electronic ignition.

Edit: I see Hanley was typing at the same time as me, albeit faster.
__________________
Neil
1977 Catalina 30
San Pedro, California
prior boats 1987 Westsail 32, 1970 Catalina 22
Had my hands in a few others
Reply With Quote
  #4   IP: 174.7.123.1
Old 07-20-2010, 01:43 PM
Paul Clarke's Avatar
Paul Clarke Paul Clarke is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: North Vancouver, BC
Posts: 12
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Not sure where my original post went, because it had diagnostic info.

Art: Thanks for your educated guess! You're right. Some previous owner installed the Indigo fresh water cooled system, including the Temperature Control Valve. I only know that because of your tip here. I've gone to the Indigo Electronics web site and confirmed it. I'll take a look at their documentation. (The first thing I noticed is that there is a sacrificial pencil zinc that is supposed to be replaced yearly; I bet it hasn't been changed in several years!); so thanks for that insightful lead. Is the "Tom Stevens" you mention someone I should contact?

Hanley: To paraphrase, you say that the heat generated by an engine running at 130 F couldn't overheat the coil. Thanks for that; it's good to know. For clarity, here's the sequence of events again:

1) Engine operated at whatever RPMs gave me about 5 knots of cruising speed in flat water for about 3 hours. Smooth operation. Temperature as measured by gauge in cockpit steady at about 130 F. Because I am nervous about this first extended outing with this new-to-me engine, I am regularly monitoring (and writing down) oil pressure, temp, amp output, and fuel levels. As it happened, I had checked temp within about 10 minutes of the onset of our troubles, and the temp was steady at 130 F.

2) Suddenly the engine revs drop (as if someone had just accidentally hit the throttle... though no one did), and then recovers to normal RPM.

3) 15 seconds later, while I am staring at the instrument panel in an ineffectual way, the engine cuts out altogether, and we are surrounded by silence as we glide to a stop.

4) In the course of checking the fuel system (tank, shut-off valve, separator, lines, etc), I opened the starboard cockpit locker and left it open.

5) Ten minutes after shut down, with the engine still stopped, my wife reports the water temp gauge is now reading about 190 F. The ignition switch is therefore still in the "on" position in order for the gauge to function, although the engine is not running.

6) A few minutes after that, a geyser of ?? steam ?? erupts from the starboard cockpit locker.

Hanley, is it possible that as the temp of the stopped engine rose to say 180 or 190 F that that temp could have caused problems?

ndutton: In the half-dozen or so short outings I've done over the last month, the engine temp has been rock steady, as you say, varying only slightly with RPM. This engine has points and condenser, not the electronic ignition.

As mentioned in my original post, the mechanic this week thought the ruptured coil was suspect. I had kept its original box it came in, and although it was labeled as a Mercury part, the mechanic said he'd never seen one that colour (red, instead of black), nor had he ever seen "Made in China" printed on the body of the coil. The ignition coil he installed states plainly on its body that no external resistor is required as it is fitted with an internal resistor. Is the mechanic right... is an internal resistor required when the ignition is by points and condenser?

In retrospect, the geyser of steam must have been from the ruptured coil. The mechanic said he'd never seen one with the internal elements rattling around like that.

-Paul
Reply With Quote
  #5   IP: 71.181.37.53
Old 07-20-2010, 03:28 PM
ArtJ ArtJ is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,177
Thanks: 221
Thanked 65 Times in 50 Posts
Tom Stevens is the owner and chief engineer of Indigo.

His website is atomic4.com which will give you his phone number.

The heat exchanger probably was made by Moyer Marine.

Regareds
Reply With Quote
  #6   IP: 71.181.37.53
Old 07-20-2010, 03:30 PM
ArtJ ArtJ is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,177
Thanks: 221
Thanked 65 Times in 50 Posts
Be careful when removing any parts or zincs from the heat exchanger.
You must use two wrenches, else you can damage the exchanger fittings.
Get a manual for the indigo unit from Tom.

Regards

Art.
Reply With Quote
  #7   IP: 173.166.26.245
Old 07-20-2010, 03:37 PM
hanleyclifford's Avatar
hanleyclifford hanleyclifford is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,978
Thanks: 172
Thanked 280 Times in 226 Posts
Talking

First of all an engine temp of 180 or 190 is STILL not hot enough to harm a coil. In fact 180/190 is ok running temp for a FW cooled A4. Your problem is in the primary ignition circuit. You may also have the wrong high voltage wires. Neil has specifications for these items which he has previously posted. Also you could check the Moyer Marine on line catalog. BTW, since you are new to this engine, get yourself a copy of the Moyer Marine Overhaul and Service Manual. It is the A4 "101" for us.
Reply With Quote
  #8   IP: 71.181.37.53
Old 07-20-2010, 04:49 PM
ArtJ ArtJ is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,177
Thanks: 221
Thanked 65 Times in 50 Posts
Please be aware that there are two distinct version of the mixing thermostatic
control with diferent connections. There is also a bleeding sequence that
must be done properly.Make sure and get the correct manual that applies
to your valve.

Art
Reply With Quote
  #9   IP: 75.197.164.201
Old 07-20-2010, 07:05 PM
Administrator's Avatar
Administrator Administrator is offline
MMI Webmaster
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Chestertown, MD (Langford Creek)
Posts: 2,198
Thanks: 1,335
Thanked 365 Times in 182 Posts
Quote:
Wonder why the original thread is closed?
Neil:

Which thread?

Bill
Reply With Quote
  #10   IP: 142.68.242.150
Old 07-20-2010, 07:51 PM
rigspelt's Avatar
rigspelt rigspelt is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,187
Thanks: 0
Thanked 19 Times in 17 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Clarke View Post
Not sure where my original post went, because it had diagnostic info.
Wierd. It was on the form earlier today when I checked it quickly on a break, and then when I got home I can't find it either. I had wanted to sit and read through your initial post carefully.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Clarke View Post
5) Ten minutes after shut down, with the engine still stopped, my wife reports the water temp gauge is now reading about 190 F. The ignition switch is therefore still in the "on" position in order for the gauge to function, although the engine is not running.
6) A few minutes after that, a geyser of ?? steam ?? erupts from the starboard cockpit locker.
Once the engine stops, I would expect the temperature at the sender to rise, because antifreeze is no longer circulating. I note that the ignition key was set to "run" for 10 minutes, so the ignition circuit would be hot. Could the coil have overheated? Was it steam or oil? I don't see how steam would have come out of a coil. Puzzler.
__________________
1974 C&C 27
Reply With Quote
  #11   IP: 173.166.26.245
Old 07-20-2010, 08:01 PM
hanleyclifford's Avatar
hanleyclifford hanleyclifford is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,978
Thanks: 172
Thanked 280 Times in 226 Posts
Exclamation

When you shut an engine down the ignition circuit should be off. If you leave the key on in order to read a temp gauge, you are in effect leaving the primary circuit hot - if the points are closed they can get plenty hot and if you do this too long you can fry a coil. Forget the cooling system - you have an ignition problem. I think you just got the wrong coil. Do not assume the mechanic put in the right coil. Neil, help us out with that specification!
Reply With Quote
  #12   IP: 142.68.242.150
Old 07-20-2010, 09:03 PM
rigspelt's Avatar
rigspelt rigspelt is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,187
Thanks: 0
Thanked 19 Times in 17 Posts
From my notes, scavenged from somewhere in the archives: Don wrote, "Our experience also suggests that heat buildup is the most tangible threat to coil life, so the coils that we have been using and marketing for over 8 years are metal-jacketed oil-filled coils with 4 ohms of resistance within the primary circuit. They have been extremely reliable, in both conventional and electronic ignition systems, with a failure rate so low as to never have made it to our radar screen of concern."
__________________
1974 C&C 27
Reply With Quote
  #13   IP: 24.152.131.220
Old 07-20-2010, 10:17 PM
ndutton's Avatar
ndutton ndutton is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Posts: 9,619
Thanks: 198
Thanked 2,208 Times in 1,425 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
Neil:

Which thread?

Bill
This one:

http://www.moyermarine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4313
__________________
Neil
1977 Catalina 30
San Pedro, California
prior boats 1987 Westsail 32, 1970 Catalina 22
Had my hands in a few others
Reply With Quote
  #14   IP: 174.7.123.1
Old 07-21-2010, 02:35 AM
Paul Clarke's Avatar
Paul Clarke Paul Clarke is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: North Vancouver, BC
Posts: 12
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Art: Thanks for the advice on the Indigo unit. I'll proceed slowly, and with the documentation in hand.

Hanley: I'll look into the specs for the ignition coil, and high voltage wires. I was concerned that the newest coil installed just a few days ago still got hot enough after several hours running to be too hot to hang onto. That bit of evidence might be important... on the other hand, not much of anything in that tiny engine space is cool enough to hang onto after 2-3 hours of running, so I'm not sure if the coil should be or not. Thanks for the tip on the Overhaul & Service Manual... I bought one a month or so ago when I was working my way through carb issues.

rigspelt: Thanks for looking up that quote re the reliability of Moyer ignition coils. It makes me think twice about the source for my spare parts.

On that note, is the electronic ignition conversion (such as the one offered for sale by Indigo) a good thing? Would you recommend it?

-Paul

C&C 27
Canvasback
North Vancouver, BC
Reply With Quote
  #15   IP: 142.68.242.150
Old 07-21-2010, 04:56 AM
rigspelt's Avatar
rigspelt rigspelt is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,187
Thanks: 0
Thanked 19 Times in 17 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Clarke View Post
is the electronic ignition conversion (such as the one offered for sale by Indigo) a good thing? Would you recommend it?
I'm no mechanic, but this is my second boat and the first thing I did after buying both was to switch to electronic ignition -- no more fussing with points and condensor. I think I got the EIM kit for our A4 from MMI.

Never leave the key on "run" without the engine running with EIM, or that expensive EIM will burn out. Should carry a spare EIM kit, but I never had a problem with the ones in our boats. Keep the old points and condensor on the boat: there are a number of threads here where operators were able to decide whether the EIM was faulty by swapping for the original points/condensor to see if whatever problem went away or persisted.
__________________
1974 C&C 27
Reply With Quote
  #16   IP: 142.68.242.150
Old 07-21-2010, 05:34 AM
rigspelt's Avatar
rigspelt rigspelt is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,187
Thanks: 0
Thanked 19 Times in 17 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by hanleyclifford View Post
Forget the cooling system - you have an ignition problem.
Hanley's post got me thinking about finding your original post, and Neil pointed out where it is, so I reviewed it again. In that post, you noted "During the delivery in the Spring with the PO and myself onboard, the engine ran flawlessly for 2 hours, then the revs began to undulate. We decided to stop at a nearby marina which had a gasoline mechanic on staff. The mechanic couldn't be sure, but thought it might be the coil. He replaced it, saying it could be that over time it heated up and that might account for the 2 hours of steady running then a drop in revs."

Then after running for 3 hours with that new coil, this: "2) Suddenly the engine revs drop (as if someone had just accidentally hit the throttle... though no one did), and then recovers to normal RPM. 3) 15 seconds later ... the engine cuts out altogether, and we are surrounded by silence as we glide to a stop." Then that new coil overheated and burst, maybe because the key was left on to watch engine temperature after the shutdown.

On the way home with the second new coil, you noted "motor for close to 18 nautical miles. I keep checking the coil, and during the first half hour or hour I *could* comfortably touch or even hold the coil, but after 2 or 3 hours of continuous running, the engine temp is up to about 145 F (slightly warmer than normal) and I could no longer hold my finger against the ignition coil. It was just too hot. I throttled back to about 4 knots as a compromise, and the engine temp gauge goes back to about 130 F."

The question now is whether there is a gremlin that caused both the first engine revolution fluctuation episode, and the second revolution fluctuation episode that was followed by a shutdown, and whether the coil is overheating. The coil blowout might have been a red herring because of the key thing. When the engine revolutions fluctuated, I presume you mean you heard the engine slow down and speed up again, not merely a tachometer fluctuation throughout which the engine sounded normal? Has that gremlin reappeared?

Those temperatures don't sound like much (normal being up to 180), so the question now is whether something electrical is heating the coil too much, and you're checking the model of coil they installed the second time to see if it is right for your A4.

Any history of other recent maintenance on the engine?
__________________
1974 C&C 27
Reply With Quote
  #17   IP: 71.181.37.53
Old 07-21-2010, 07:25 AM
ArtJ ArtJ is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,177
Thanks: 221
Thanked 65 Times in 50 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Clarke View Post
Art: Thanks for the advice on the Indigo unit. I'll proceed slowly, and with the documentation in hand.


On that note, is the electronic ignition conversion (such as the one offered for sale by Indigo) a good thing? Would you recommend it?

-Paul

C&C 27
Canvasback
North Vancouver, BC
I have had the indigio electronic ignition installed for 12 years. it has been
totally reliable with no failures. I bought a second at the time as a backup
which has proved helpful in isolating ignition issues.
I have on occasion left the ignition switch on while troubleshooting
other systems and have never had it fail for any reason.

I don't have any experience with the Moyer unit, but many others on this
site do.
Reply With Quote
  #18   IP: 173.166.26.245
Old 07-21-2010, 08:20 AM
hanleyclifford's Avatar
hanleyclifford hanleyclifford is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,978
Thanks: 172
Thanked 280 Times in 226 Posts
Talking

I think it is time to start scrutinizing this electrical system. Coils don't fail because of normal engine heat. Starting with the ignition switch, test voltage with the engine running. Make sure voltage regulator is "regulating". Ensure all high voltage leads to plugs are of the same type. Check primary voltage at coil with engine running. Also see this months newsletter, page 4.(Ignition and Electrical Systems) Also see Don Moyer's comments from 2005 on the thread " some coments on coils".

Last edited by hanleyclifford; 07-21-2010 at 08:27 AM. Reason: addition
Reply With Quote
  #19   IP: 64.231.91.201
Old 07-21-2010, 04:16 PM
67c&ccorv's Avatar
67c&ccorv 67c&ccorv is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: London, ON
Posts: 1,559
Thanks: 4
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rigspelt View Post
I'm no mechanic, but this is my second boat and the first thing I did after buying both was to switch to electronic ignition -- no more fussing with points and condensor. I think I got the EIM kit for our A4 from MMI.

Never leave the key on "run" without the engine running with EIM, or that expensive EIM will burn out. Should carry a spare EIM kit...
Words to live...and learn by!
Reply With Quote
  #20   IP: 24.152.131.220
Old 07-21-2010, 08:20 PM
ndutton's Avatar
ndutton ndutton is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Posts: 9,619
Thanks: 198
Thanked 2,208 Times in 1,425 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by rigspelt View Post
Never leave the key on "run" without the engine running with EIM, or that expensive EIM will burn out.
The oil pressure/water temp alarm system available from MMI and others alerts you to a key on - no run condition.
__________________
Neil
1977 Catalina 30
San Pedro, California
prior boats 1987 Westsail 32, 1970 Catalina 22
Had my hands in a few others
Reply With Quote
  #21   IP: 142.68.255.169
Old 07-22-2010, 05:36 AM
rigspelt's Avatar
rigspelt rigspelt is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,187
Thanks: 0
Thanked 19 Times in 17 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ndutton View Post
The oil pressure/water temp alarm system available from MMI and others alerts you to a key on - no run condition.
Very good point. When we bought this boat, the mechanic I had in to inspect the A4 said to add one first thing, so we got the kit from MMI. It has been quite helpful in that regard, as well as reassurring while running. We installed an Aqualarm flow detector in the seawater line too.
__________________
1974 C&C 27
Reply With Quote
  #22   IP: 75.197.219.122
Old 07-22-2010, 07:48 AM
Administrator's Avatar
Administrator Administrator is offline
MMI Webmaster
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Chestertown, MD (Langford Creek)
Posts: 2,198
Thanks: 1,335
Thanked 365 Times in 182 Posts
Thanks to Neil for pointing out this inadvertently closed thread. I'm assuming I must have done it, but I don't remember whether a forum member can close a thread he/she started.

Anyway, it's been re-opened.

Bill
Reply With Quote
  #23   IP: 24.152.131.220
Old 07-22-2010, 08:05 AM
ndutton's Avatar
ndutton ndutton is offline
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Posts: 9,619
Thanks: 198
Thanked 2,208 Times in 1,425 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
Thanks to Neil for pointing out this inadvertently closed thread. I'm assuming I must have done it, but I don't remember whether a forum member can close a thread he/she started.
It appears that a thread starter/author can close their own thread. The mechanism is found under the thread tools tab but only on their own thread.
__________________
Neil
1977 Catalina 30
San Pedro, California
prior boats 1987 Westsail 32, 1970 Catalina 22
Had my hands in a few others
Reply With Quote
  #24   IP: 206.125.176.3
Old 07-22-2010, 09:16 AM
sastanley's Avatar
sastanley sastanley is online now
Afourian MVP
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Solomons, MD
Posts: 7,016
Thanks: 1,134
Thanked 600 Times in 442 Posts
Uh, no..now what do we do? We have two threads?

I'll quote Paul's initial post here and see if we can keep this one on track:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Clarke View Post
Hi folks,

I'll introduce myself, as I am new here, though I have been lurking since April when I bought a 1972 C&C 27 sailboat with its original A-4. It's a pleasure to be able to read older threads to get an overall feel for a subject.

My concern involves heat.

During the delivery in the Spring with the PO and myself onboard, the engine ran flawlessly for 2 hours, then the revs began to undulate. We decided to stop at a nearby marina which had a gasoline mechanic on staff. The mechanic couldn't be sure, but thought it might be the coil. He replaced it, saying it could be that over time it heated up and that might account for the 2 hours of steady running then a drop in revs.

I was sufficiently concerned with the Atomic 4 that when I had the boat surveyed, I also paid to have a mechanical survey of the engine done. I was advised to pull the carb and send it out for an overhaul, which I did. Otherwise, the report on the engine was that it clearly had had owners who had maintained it, and properly looked after it, including newish alternator, fuel/water separator, etc.

A week ago I set out on our first family cruise, and ran into troubles: after running for 4.5 hours to cross Georgia Strait from Vancouver towards Vancouver Island, the engine revs dipped, regained, then 10 seconds later the engine quit altogether. No luck trying to restart. 10 minutes later we noticed the engine temp had soared to 190 F (from its usual 130 F running temp). Then there was a geyser of steam which erupted from the stb cockpit locker (which is open to the engine space). With no wind, we were lucky to get a tow from a good Samaritan to where I had access to a mechanic.

Two days and several hours of the mechanics time later, I had a new alternator belt, and yet another new coil.

That eruption? That was the coil getting so hot it burst its seal and sprayed its liquid. And that brings me to my question of heat.

Would an engine operating at 130 F generate enough heat to make a good ignition coil too hot to leave a finger on? I ask, because my mechanic said I should be able to touch it and not get burned when the engine was fully up to temperature. I can't touch the engine head, for example, without getting burned.

Here are some possibilities:

1) After the engine comes up to a stable temperature, the engine temp gauge in the cockpit reads approx 130 F. The temp gauge is not that old (less than 5 years by the looks of things), but I suppose it could be completely wrong in its indication.

2) The engine is fresh water cooled, and has a fancy valve that looks like it is adjustable to increase or decrease water flow. Perhaps too little flow is happening?

3) Perhaps the engine is running at a temp that is absolutely normal, and the temp gauge is working just fine, but the coil was defective. My mechanic asked if the one the PO and I had installed several months ago had an internal resistor in it. I didn't know, and the coil had little in the way of labeling, other than "Made in China". My mechanic said either we needed an ignition coil with an internal resistor, or we needed an inline resistor. He installed a good quality coil with an internal resistor in it. That leaves me wondering if the suspect coil just wasn't up to multiple hours of running?

So maybe the coil objects, and the engine shuts down. Therefore, no more cooling water is circulating. We go from cruising at 5 knots to stopped. Naturally the engine temp rises. Would that normally cause an ignition coil to "blow"? Is there a good reason why the coil is mounted less than an inch away from the source of a lot of heat radiating from the back of the engine head?

Finally, the mechanic sends me on my way. I'm wary, and nervous. The holiday is all but over, and there is no wind. I'm forced to motor for close to 18 nautical miles. I keep checking the coil, and during the first half hour or hour I *could* comfortably touch or even hold the coil, but after 2 or 3 hours of continuous running, the engine temp is up to about 145 F (slightly warmer than normal) and I could no longer hold my finger against the ignition coil. It was just too hot. I throttled back to about 4 knots as a compromise, and the engine temp gauge goes back to about 130 F.

I was very happy to reach that night's anchorage, I can tell you.

Too many issues are "new" to me... 35 years of sailing and motoring under my belt, but I am a raw recruit when it comes to this particular engine.

Any insights?

-Paul

C&C 27
Canvasback
I've been off on vacation sailing in a local regatta for a couple of days, but now I am BACK, so here is my $0.02!

Paul, Your unexplainable RPM shifting is similar to a coil failure I had a couple of years ago....odd RPM changes with no throttle adjustment, and finally after 30 seconds of this, it would just peter out. In my case, the coil was the original Delco unit, mounted on the back of the motor. I installed a new Flamethrower, similar to the one Don's sells in his store, and mounted it on the wall, inside the engine compartment, after reading that sometimes coil life can be shortened due to vibration & heat of the motor. So, even though the OEM coil lasted 30 years, I mounted my new one off the motor, because at the time, the old coil was suspect, but would run just fine for 60 minutes before it faded. Mounting the spare off the motor allowed a 5 minute swap over on the wires (in the middle of Eastern Bay last spring!) & no coil/ignition related issues since then.

Temperature fluctuation - We have all inadvertently left the key on when we have unexpected running/start problems with the motor. I have a RWC engine and have seen the temp almost immediately (within a minute) rise after shutting the motor off (140 at idle & 160 running temps) to 200+ degrees on the gauge. rigspelt's comment above about the non-circulating cooling water soaking the heat out of the engine block is spot on. I would not call this condition abnormal.

I am a little late to the party, but welcome to the group. Get the 3 ohm Flamethrower (from Moyer or the Internet, I have the PERTRONIX #40501) and let's get you back on track!
__________________
-Shawn
"Holiday" - '89 Alura 35 #109
"Twice Around" - '77 C-30, #511 with original A-4 & MMI manifold - SOLD! (no longer a two boat owner!!)
http://www.moyermarine.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic3231_6.gif
Reply With Quote
  #25   IP: 64.203.32.52
Old 07-22-2010, 09:32 AM
Dave Neptune Dave Neptune is online now
Afourian MVP, Professor Emeritus
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Grove, Oklahoma
Posts: 5,035
Thanks: 711
Thanked 1,289 Times in 839 Posts
Lightbulb Another $0.02

I have had the Indigo unit for about 8 years and the reason I went to it was I hadn't run into Moyer Marine yet. I modified an old racing ignition (Allison photo optic rated to 12,000rpm's) set I had from a time long ago and installed it in my A-4 26 years ago. It too was photo optic and I had worked with many of them over the years and was quite familiar with their reliability. The Pertronix unit is a good one to although it seems to have a bit of trouble with the coil being used.
My preferance is the Indigo (sorry Don) only because it has an indicator light that shows when the unit is operating, another handy diagnostic contribution that's easy to "see".

Dave Neptune
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Safe Operating Temps Paul Clarke General Interest 0 07-19-2010 11:29 PM
Temperature Gauge Sending Unit Jesse Delanoy Cooling System 6 10-25-2008 07:41 AM
Erratic temperature gauge HerbertFriedman Cooling System 0 10-11-2007 09:43 PM
Temperature gauge problems? omec Cooling System 0 07-16-2007 12:37 PM
installed alarms now engine temp not right eric 352 General Interest 8 01-21-2005 11:33 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:29 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.


Universal® is a registered trademark of Westerbeke Corporation

Copyright © 2004-2024 Moyer Marine Inc.

All Rights Reserved