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  #1   IP: 173.50.76.170
Old 05-26-2013, 08:13 PM
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Salty Tasting Spark Plugs?

Finally decided to stop being a wuss and went for a real sail today. 12-14 knots wind, gusting to 17+. 2 -3 foot swells with little 1 foot chop on top. . Routinely hitting 7 knots heading back to little creek, and in a couple gusts got close to 8

T'was fun indeed!

Not so much fun coming back. . .engine wouldn't start. Had spark, had fuel to carb. Water separator filter was spun off and dumped, didn't notice any water. After priming, the engine started with some difficulty but smoothed out and we had no issues getting back to the dock.

Funny thing is, part of the on water diagnostic was pulling a plug to see if it was wet with fuel. I pulled the #1 plug and it was wet, but it wasn't gas. I tasted it and it was salty. I had one of my guests (who was helping) taste the #2 and he said it was salty as well

Also note, the fuel system is damn near brand new (year old) and I just put fresh gas in the other day and we had zero issues getting out. The 2 - 3 teaspoons of water that came out the carb bowl was brownish.

The exhaust is just a straight shot out the back, I removed the muffler as part of a diagnostic and never out it back on. Figured it ran fine, why bother?

What are the chances that seawater made it's way down an open exhaust valve and flooded the carb?

-OR-

What are the chances that old water in the separator just got churned up and I sucked in some rust water AND happen to have an internal leak?

Mind you, the engine ran like a top till I shut it off. It wouldn't start at all until everything was drained. I'd assume I would have gotten a few seconds of run time before the engine pumped the water down from the filter to the carb.

Not sure where to start or what to think of this. . .I cancelled tomorrows planned trip so I can flush out the fuel system and change the filters and suck out the bottom of the tank and see if anything was down there. . .

It's just the salty taste has me a little worried. . .

Thoughts, ideas, comments, etc. welcome

Last edited by Cool Beans; 05-26-2013 at 08:17 PM.
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  #2   IP: 67.71.50.5
Old 05-26-2013, 09:26 PM
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"The exhaust is just a straight shot out the back, I removed the muffler as part of a diagnostic and never out it back on. Figured it ran fine, why bother?"

Can you elaborate...maybe a photo?

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  #3   IP: 173.166.26.241
Old 05-26-2013, 10:01 PM
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Talking

Salt laden moist air would have no trouble getting to a combustion chamber via an open valve. That's why professional captains run their engines every day. I admit I don't always do it in a marina but one a week at least. Your straight exhaust is a suspect.
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  #4   IP: 64.231.112.109
Old 05-27-2013, 05:53 AM
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I am assuming from sailing conditions and wave heights you mave have stirred up some crud and water in tank.

Fuel condition would be a priority check.
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  #5   IP: 75.197.191.50
Old 05-27-2013, 08:42 AM
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If I remember correctly from Don, I believe the "straight exhaust" design can be found in the Catalina 27 fleet, those members of the Tartan fleet with center cabin engines, and all of the old Pearson Triton and Pearson Vanguards.

Bill
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  #6   IP: 75.197.191.50
Old 05-27-2013, 08:45 AM
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In some fuel tanks, the pickup tube sees only gasoline when the boat is at rest, but picks up water when underway and the stern squats a bit.

Don't ask me how I know.

Bill

Last edited by Administrator; 05-27-2013 at 11:19 AM.
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  #7   IP: 68.56.139.11
Old 05-27-2013, 11:11 AM
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Sorry to disagree, but there is no such thing as "salt air".

Salt does not evaporate with the water, it stays behind.
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  #8   IP: 24.224.152.244
Old 05-27-2013, 01:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by romantic comedy View Post
Sorry to disagree, but there is no such thing as "salt air".

Salt does not evaporate with the water, it stays behind.
Agree, had the local power company try and tell us in a TV interview that the outage was due to "salt fog". People went wild on them.


When the boat heals when sailing the vent may dip in the water. As the boat moves through the water a siphon effect can occur drawing some water in the tank. You aren't the first and you won't be the last. If you remember just a simple wrap of electrical tape around the vent fitting would prevent that but you would have to remove it once the sails are down and you start up the engine.
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The pessimist complains about the wind.
The optimist expects it to change.
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  #9   IP: 173.50.76.170
Old 05-27-2013, 09:32 PM
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real quickly, watching Skyfall. . .the tank vent is high up on the cockpit coaming, we went nuts yesterday but I know we didn't go over that far

I'll get a picture of the exhaust setup in the next day or two. . .looking at it in the boat, the exhaust outlet doesn't look all that lower than the top of the dry stack. . .
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  #10   IP: 193.253.220.149
Old 05-28-2013, 04:03 AM
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While it's true that the salt is left behind when salt water evaporates, it is also true that salt becomes airborne in windy conditions and can travel quite some distance inland as small water droplets. Incredibly fast corrosion rates and burned garden plants at our home about 500m from the shore attest to this fact.
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Old 05-28-2013, 06:10 AM
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Hi Kelly,
I live 1 km from the shore and following a 60 or 70 mph storm that blows in from the sea (four or five times a year) I have to rinse the vehicles and house windows. But spray is a different animal...I experience it on the back end of the boat occasionally as well...lol
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"Odyssey"
1976 C&C 30 MKI

The pessimist complains about the wind.
The optimist expects it to change.
The realist adjusts the sails.
...Sir William Arthur Ward.
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Old 05-28-2013, 12:20 PM
JOHN COOKSON JOHN COOKSON is offline
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As A Long Shot

Perhaps some sort of communication between the fuel system and the cooling system in the manifold or the manifold gasket??? The condition was aggravted when the boat was heeled??? This is off the top of my head - I don't know if it's even possible. Pressure testing the manifold in place would rule this in\out.

TRUE GRIT
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Old 05-28-2013, 02:05 PM
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RWC ...absolutely possible John.

? head gasket
? water jacket
? rusted block
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"Odyssey"
1976 C&C 30 MKI

The pessimist complains about the wind.
The optimist expects it to change.
The realist adjusts the sails.
...Sir William Arthur Ward.
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Old 05-29-2013, 10:59 PM
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Had same problem with my cat 27, No restart after hard sail and plugs water fouled,changed riser in exhaust to as close as possible to cockpit floor, approx. 1 1/2 inches and added anti siphon valve on water injection hose, fixed it. Also be sure you have rubber flapper on exhaust outlet.
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Old 05-29-2013, 11:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RMark View Post
Had same problem with my cat 27, No restart after hard sail and plugs water fouled,changed riser in exhaust to as close as possible to cockpit floor, approx. 1 1/2 inches and added anti siphon valve on water injection hose, fixed it. Also be sure you have rubber flapper on exhaust outlet.
Have to agree...very common reason. Cool Beans...I know you looked into it but did you ever rule it out?
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"Odyssey"
1976 C&C 30 MKI

The pessimist complains about the wind.
The optimist expects it to change.
The realist adjusts the sails.
...Sir William Arthur Ward.
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  #16   IP: 173.50.76.170
Old 06-01-2013, 05:02 PM
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All right Mark! Sounds like my issue. . .and I hope it is, sounds better than holes in the water jacket

So. . .drained the carb bowl again, and got about 1/8 teaspoon of water out (white/milky). Manually pumped fuel through till it was clear (4 cups total, only 1st had water, rest were clean). Removed the filter and hoses between pump and carb and blew them into the cup. Clean of dirt, free of water. Removed the sediment bowl, couple specs of dirt, free of water. Removed the water separator filter, free of dirt and water. Sucked about a half gallon from the bottom of the tank, free of dirt and water. Reinstalled new filter and made sure no leaks. Ran engine at dock and she ran like a top! I'm thinking the fuel system is good to go!

Exhaust system is something else. Um. . .pictures speak for themselves. I have a whole album I took today at the boat. please don't judge me on half finished projects and the general mess of "The Dungeon"

The top of the exhaust looks to be at about the level of the exhaust exit. Hard to judge by looking since everything kind of slopes in weird directions. . .also, that open hose to the left of the exhaust at the transom is from a manual bilge pump I'm removing/replacing and some water made it in though that hose.

Any and all expert opinion appreciated



Album:

http://www.moyermarine.com/forums/album.php?albumid=127
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  #17   IP: 67.71.50.5
Old 06-02-2013, 01:43 AM
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After looking at the photos of your exhaust system I am not surprised you have "salty tasting sparkplugs".

A nearly "straight shot" for sea water to the exhaust valve opening.

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  #18   IP: 173.50.76.170
Old 06-02-2013, 10:05 AM
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I wonder if that's why the PO had a valve in the exhaust stack

Close that valve when a rough sail is expected? Close the engine intake?

Would the more permanent solution be to just raise the dry stack portion? I could put a 45 degree piece in to bring it past the cockpit side and then up another foot. . .

Thanks
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  #19   IP: 67.71.50.5
Old 06-02-2013, 01:13 PM
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There is a "gate valve" in photo #8 of your collection...I am assuming that is what the previous owner intended it for?

I would rather have a "swinging check valve" in the system.

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